This Week #1

Lof File for “This Week’s Episode #1″ folder in Babylon 5 – America Online

Subj: Re: I & E SPOILERS maybe?
Date: 96-05-13 19:12:40 EDT
From: JavaStacee
Posted on: America Online

Londo is easily decieved because of his short sightedness. He is very clever and can play the political game well, but he will always be a danger to himself and others because he looks for the quick fix, and ends up painting himself into a corner.

Subj: Re:The Red Vorlon
Date: 96-05-13 19:58:05 EDT
From: Hit Man377
Posted on: America Online

The red vorlon ship was the first ship to attack and destroy a shadow ship in that scene.

Subj: Medlab question
Date: 96-05-13 20:04:47 EDT
From: RosalindB
Posted on: America Online

Who’s going to run Medlab with Franklin’s resignation?
Rosalind

Subj: Re:Medlab question
Date: 96-05-13 21:39:04 EDT
From: Oct1330
Posted on: America Online

Yes, does anyone know the real story about Franklin….did the actor wish to leave B-5? Or will he find the future equivalent of Betty Ford and come back? Oct 1330

Subj: I & E Comments
Date: 96-05-13 22:42:20 EDT
From: SarahB6201
Posted on: America Online

A little spoiler space…

 

 

 

 

 

 

OK that should do it…Just a few thoughts; someone mentioned that Kosh might not actually be dead the way we think of it, citing Merlin as an example, and Yoda and Obi Wan from “Star Wars”, all good examples of spiritual beings who die in the story to be resurrected later. Let’s not forget to add Gandalf from “Lord of the Rings” to that list. He “died”, only to return later…hm…
Also, someone asked if Richard Biggs (Dr. Franklin) was leaving the show since his character resigned from Medlab. I saw Richard at a scifi convention a few weeks ago, and he didn’t mention that he was leaving the show. Just because Stephen can’t be a doctor doesn’t mean he has to leave Babylon 5…

Subj: Re: I & E SPOILERS maybe?
Date: 96-05-13 22:57:18 EDT
From: DaveShufon
Posted on: America Online

<<OK.. I cannot believe LONDO would actually fall for this trick of Morden! I mean.. who else would gain more but Morden! He should have known or suspected that Morden was behind Adira’s death!>>

Why wouldn’t Londo think this? After all, he doesn’t know that Morden found out about Adira. However, Adira has been going around Centauri Prime for the past couple of years wearing Londo’s family pin. Don’t you think people back there would gossip about something like this? And Refa is obsessed with controling the government and getting rid of anyone who opposes him. You don’t think he has people gathering any information they can that could be used against anyone in the government? Of course *he* would know about Adira.

And he has a reason to try to get back at Londo since he’s been poisoned. Sure he doesn’t want Londo to deliver the other half of the poison, but by taking out Adira he wasn’t violating any of Londo’s demands (to pull back their forces and break off contact with Morden). In fact, he could be sending Londo a message. “You’re not untouchable.” Refa is a very powerfull man, and even if Londo killed him first there could be others with orders to kill Londo, or those he loves, if anything should happen to Refa.

This is the way Centauri politics used to be played, and Londo was the first to move in this direction. It’s no coincidence that we were shown a flashback to that scene here where Londo says this himself. Should he really be surprised that Refa has taken the next step?

No. I don’t see how you can criticize Londo for thinking Refa was behind it. He didn’t have the benefit of seeing Morden inquiring about what was going on in the Zocalo, or finding out about Adira, or paying off the passenger on Adira’s ship, or hearing the changes in the soundtrack when Morden was in the scenes like we did.

Subj: Re: Morden
Date: 96-05-13 23:07:17 EDT
From: MPimm
Posted on: America Online

Looks like Morden has more space….with a little help from his shadow friends. I can’t stand it that Kosh is gone. That was the saddest show ever.

Subj: Need tape of I&E
Date: 96-05-13 23:15:30 EDT
From: RangerRuss
Posted on: America Online

A power outage zapped my VCR before I&Examinations showed. If anyone is willing to make a copy please let me know and we’ll work the details out. Thanks RangerRuss@aol.com

Subj: Re:I&E — JMS you amaze me
Date: 96-05-14 00:20:30 EDT
From: Jms at B5
Posted on: America Online

Thanks. For me, the whole purpose of an entertainment is to make you feel something; if this episode succeeded in that, then the effort was worthwhile.

jms

 

Subj: I&E Question
Date: 96-05-14 00:21:51 EDT
From: Badinov
Posted on: America Online

At the end of the Kosh/David Sheridan dream sequence, there is a quick (2 sec) scene of B5 being sucked through a hole in space.

Did anyone else catch this?

What does that have to do with Kosh’s situation?
Badinov

Subj: Re:I & E Comments
Date: 96-05-14 01:38:58 EDT
From: Its a myth
Posted on: America Online

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<<Also, someone asked if Richard Biggs (Dr. Franklin) was leaving the show since his character resigned from Medlab. I saw Richard at a scifi convention a few weeks ago, and he didn’t mention that he was leaving the show. Just because Stephen can’t be a doctor doesn’t mean he has to leave Babylon 5…>>

…and just because he doesn’t work in MedLab doesn’t mean he can’t be a doctor. I bet he relocates to Down Below to tend to the Lurker population’s needs.

Subj: Re:3 Things about “Sic Transit
Date: 96-05-14 01:50:03 EDT
From: Balance7
Posted on: America Online

Ebalyka>>Three, I wish that they would stop portraying the Centari as some kind of Nazis. They are an honorable people with ancient traditions. For instance, when the Emperor showed up on the station the Centari were trying to make peace even as the Narn attempted to kill him. Before that they were very noble, if scheming. The way I see it is that the Centari are drunk with their power and their victories. They are the real villians; Clark’s goons and the Shadows are.<<

My impression is that the Centauri are more comparable to the British in their overly imperial times. That is, late 19th, early 20th century. The Earth Alliance is more like the Russians prior to WWII, making deals with the devil (Shadows/Germany) and using crushing domestic policies. I know the EA hasn’t made a pact with the Shadows directly, but practically by making one with the Centauri.

Regarding Londo, keep another eye on him. His recovery from villiany is fragile and may be easily compromised as it appears to be happening.

Subj: Re:A Late Delivery From Aval
Date: 96-05-14 01:58:27 EDT
From: Balance7
Posted on: America Online

<1. Garibaldi was a jerk.>

Garibaldi was trying to help someone with addiction, something he has a problem with. Anytime a person tries to help someone with a problem they also suffer from, there is likely a difficult edge. It comes from a reminder of how bad it used to be.

Subj: Re:Ship of Tears
Date: 96-05-14 02:02:40 EDT
From: Balance7
Posted on: America Online

>>> The enemy of my enemy is my friend.. I liked that. Looked like some peoples theories were right!<<
But I will never trust Bester. His power may come in handy but he will always have his own very closely held and quite at odds with our heros agenda. Psycops may be necessary to effectively fight against the shadows, but we should never ever trust Bester or the troops he sends.

Subj: Re: Other
Date: 96-05-14 02:05:15 EDT
From: Balance7
Posted on: America Online

>>>You know, I was at the Utah Jazz game last night cheering my team on to victory when I looked up and, what? Babylon 5 was one of the sponsors last night. How could this happen? One of the things I love most sponsoring the other. To JMS or whoever is responsible: THANKS!!!!!

Can’t wait for tomorrow’s episode!<<<

The show comes on KJZZ TV here in Salt Lake, the station is owned by the Jazz’s owner and shows Jazz games all the time. Sometimes preempting B5.
Subj: Re:Who is Mordred?
Date: 96-05-14 02:11:16 EDT
From: Balance7
Posted on: America Online

>>The whole issue of Mordred being the bastard son of Arthur through a semi-incestuous relationship was what stumped me. Has Sheridan been up to things we haven’t heard about?

I was also confused by the who’s who at the end of the show. Marcus refered to Franklin as Bedivere earlier, but I swear he said Franklin was Percival in the little run-down at the end. Of course, the identification with Percival is completely confusing if it is indeed what Marcus said. I’ll have to go back and listen again, I suppose.

BTW, Marcus identified himself as Galahad (being pure and all, ha ha), and Ivanova as Gawain. Personally, I would have identified Marcus as Percival (the innocent from outside the courtly circle who at last achieves the Grail). <<

I figure all the references comparing B5 characters to Authurian are just a joke with the audience, not to be taken too literally. There has been a lot of discussion on the internet B5 newsgroups on connections with Tolkien (frequently unflattering comparisions). This may have been a slap in the face of those folks as well as interesting symbolic drama.

But if we take it seriously… Morden might be thought of as an wayward son of humanity. He has strayed and is leading his own people to hell.
Subj: Re: Morden
Date: 96-05-14 02:25:21 EDT
From: Balance7
Posted on: America Online

>>In this weeks episodes it shows Morden back on B5, How did he get back on B5? Sheridan knew that he had shadows with him all the time, shouldn’t he have left a message at all entry points to watch out for him?<<

IN the opening sequence of the ep, Morden is shown paying off a security cop to get on board. There is a voice over explaing the strain on B5 resources that make this possible.

Subj: Re: I & E SPOILERS maybe?
Date: 96-05-14 02:27:42 EDT
From: Balance7
Posted on: America Online
>>OK.. I cannot believe LONDO would actually fall for this trick of Morden! I mean.. who else would gain more but Morden! He should have known or suspected that Morden was behind Adira’s death!<<

I agree, I felt that Londo was way too easily taken considering he is a terrible con man in his own right and he knew that Morden was POed and despairate.
Subj: Re:I&E Question.
Date: 96-05-14 18:43:44 EDT
From: Delennn
Posted on: America Online

>At the end of the Kosh/David Sheridan dream sequence, there is a quick (2 sec) scene of B5
being sucked through a hole in space.

Did anyone else catch this?

What does that have to do with Kosh’s situation?<

I believe that ‘hole’ was actually Kosh’s soul or spirit or whatever, enveloping the station upon Kosh’s death. I don’t remember seeing anything moving in the scene except the white wave that made it’s way down B5 and off into the universe.

Subj: Londo.
Date: 96-05-14 18:48:42 EDT
From: BRIMEE
Posted on: America Online

I don’t believe that Londo really was fooled by Morden.
He could simply be faking out Morden so that Morden lets down his guard
BRI @)

Subj: Re:Londo.
Date: 96-05-14 19:10:48 EDT
From: SPLEENEX
Posted on: America Online

Don’t forget, he was emotionally shattered by Adira’s death.It would require far more inner strength than Londo has (or has displayed) to retain his cool, calculating exterior imediately after hearing of the death of a loved one, and probably long after.These are not Star-Drek characters,do not mistake them as such.They are emotional and have depth enough to actually respond to the loss of a lover.

Subj: Re:Londo.
Date: 96-05-14 19:15:11 EDT
From: MNSTTJZZ
Posted on: America Online

<<<The show comes on KJZZ TV here in Salt Lake, the station is owned by the Jazz’s owner and shows Jazz games all the time. Sometimes preempting B5>>>

Of coarse I know that! But, don’t forget, it’s still on! Yeah, it’s on at 12:00, but it’s better than not being on at all! But, KJZZ is the official station for the Utah Jazz and since they don’t make the Jazz’s schedual they’ve got to show the game instead of the show. Just watch the game(if you like the Jazz that is. That’s what I do ‘cus I love the Jazz!) and then record the show and watch it the next day. Then you can fast forward though the commercials! Kill two birds with one stone eh?

!!!!!!!!Spoiler for War without end part I !!!!!!!!!!!!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 
Wonderfull! Simply wonderful! I love it, I love it, I love it!!!!!!!!! JMS, another sucess! Almost as good as Severed Dreams! Zathris(hope I spelled it right) what a weird guy! “Sorry! Didn’t see you there! Zathris thinking inportant thoughts, didn’t see you there! Zathris thinking important thoughts…””Zathris used to being beast of burden. Not good life. Probably not have good death. But, simmitry! You go! Zathris take care!…” Yeah, it’s not word for word but good nontheless. Boy, I wish I hadn’t missed that first season. With B5 reapearing and Sinclair… I missed alot… And I’ll regret it forever… Sinclair sure is intriging. This episode would have made a great cliffhanger! Everyone would be insuspence all summer long! I’m going nuts waiting for next Monday! I can’t wait! Ahhhhhhggggggggg!!!!!!!!!!! i can’t stand it!

My prediction is that Sinclair is Valen, but what is so special about Sheridan? Zathris says that he is grateful to meat Sinclair for many reasons, but he is also grateful to meet Sheridan for OTHER reasons. Hummmmmmmmm………. What ARE these OTHER reasons?
I loved the scene of Sheridan holding Delenn’s hand and when Sinclair sees this he sortof smiles. Like he’s pleased that this is happening. And then later after Sheridan is lost in time Delenn is SOOOO worried about him. You can tell she cares for him VERRRY much. It was kinda interesting how Sinclair had to try and convice Susan that trying to find Sheridan now would be a mistake and that he would want them to go ahead with the mission without him. This crew has become sooo close that it’s hard for them to loose someone especially their leader.
In the same way you can tell how disapointed Garabaldi is at being left out of all this. Not being able to see his old Captain… i loved the scene between Zack and Sinclair too. That was nice. Sinclair seemed so friendly there. He seemed like such a great guy. Boy, I really wish I hadn’t missed that season with him….

Well that’s enough from me for now.

-Tom

Subj: War Without End, Part 1
Date: 96-05-15 13:08:37 EDT
From: ZED30
Posted on: America Online

Oh geez…. Oh gosh….

SPOILER SPACE
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I feel like I’ve been pummelled with a brick. A very large brick.

This has been said repeatedly this season, but once more, I have to say… This was one of the best hours of sci-fi TV ever, and it’s only part one. My head is swimming trying to assimilate everything going on in this episode, and that’s without even starting to ponder time paradoxes.

I think I’ve got a better grasp of the ‘Big Picture’ now. And its really funny to see how easily we can be fooled by JMS’ great scripts. I’ve seen so many movies, tv shows, books, etc that I rarely am surprised by twists in anything, except on Babylon 5. It never occurred to me for one second that B4 was taken into the past, but now it seems so obvious.

Oh geez… Oh gosh…. I’m never gonna make it till next Monday.

Subj: I & E & Bab5
Date: 96-05-15 19:30:58 EDT
From: DelanySis1
Posted on: America Online

Spoiler!

 

 

 
This is about the image shown right before Kosh dies. I saw it as a ship (can’t tell if it’s babylon 5) being sucked into something-it looked to me like the ship was moving, not the light. I can’t for the life of me figure this out-is it Bab5 (or Bab4, for that matter)? Another ship entirely? Is it being destroyed or saved? What does Kosh have to do with it? What does it all MEEEAAANNN?

I love this show!

Subj: Re:Mordred/Morden
Date: 96-05-15 20:32:15 EDT
From: LadyPomona
Posted on: America Online

As I understand it, “Morden” is the infinitive form of the German verb meaning “to murder”. But he also fits the role of Mordred quite nicely!

Subj: Spoiler WWE One/Speculation
Date: 96-05-16 03:30:49 EDT
From: Gator22277
Posted on: America Online

Spoiler for WWEI
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While rewatching WWEI my friend noticed something rather interesting. In Ivonovas audio-only warning from the future she says Earth Alliance Station B5…as opposed to the later visual warning where she only says B5.

Just maybe they are not the same future. Maybe if B4 is stollen as before the future turns out failry badely aswell…….

Subj: Re:Merlin
Date: 96-05-16 08:54:34 EDT
From: JojoWyld
Posted on: America Online

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How right you are,KngDavidA.
I can sum up the episode where 1 ambassador dies as “Whoah!”

Subj: Re:Fox Killing ME !!!!!!
Date: 96-05-16 09:15:26 EDT
From: JojoWyld
Posted on: America Online

Try moving up to the Dallas/Ft.Worth area. We get it regularly on KTXA ch 21 (UPN)

Subj: Re: I & E SPOILERS maybe?
Date: 96-05-16 09:22:37 EDT
From: JojoWyld
Posted on: America Online

I think that Morden manipulated Londo and just made him THINK that Refa killed Adira just to get Londo “back in the fold”. Morden probably contacted Refa about the killing, but I think his little unseen friends did the actual deed.

Subj: Re:Spoiler WWE One/Speculati
Date: 96-05-16 09:32:28 EDT
From: JojoWyld
Posted on: America Online

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Once again, I am glued to the edge of my seat, tears beginning to stream down my face at the thought of another character lost.
I agree about the possiblity of there being more than one time-line in effect in Sector 14.
Unfortunately, my mind is still toast from that episode, it aired here on Tuesday and now it’s Thursday! I cannot remember a time before this where a TV show has gripped me so much.

Subj: Re:Morgan le Fay
Date: 96-05-16 13:53:12 EDT
From: MShan15048
Posted on: America Online

There is one problem, check out the Morte D’Arthur, rather than the later runs.

Morgana is half sister to Arthur, but not mother of Mordred or wife of Lot of Orkney.

Morgause is the other half sister to Arthur, and the mother of Mordred and wife of Lot of Orkney.

Morgana is a half-for/half-against character in the legend, who steals Arthur’s sword and destroys the sheath (Which holds the real magic), but also is the leader of the ladies who carry Arthur to Avalon.

Subj: Re:Morden’s head
Date: 96-05-16 14:09:57 EDT
From: MShan15048
Posted on: America Online

Am I reading something wrong into the show, but having watched the episode several times, I always get the impression that there is something going on in Morden’s eyes as he watches Kosh murdered. It looked to me like a look of horror at what he was seeing, tinged with regret.

Is Morden under a control that had to slip as the Shadow’s had to face such a strong opponent?

Subj: Re:Fox Killing ME !!!!!!
Date: 96-05-16 15:37:23 EDT
From: DaveAtCWRU
Posted on: America Online

Denver plays it at 1:00 pm on saturdays and 11:00 AM on sundays. If the saturday date gets pre-empted, you are almost guarenteed to see it on sunday since nothing ever happens on Sunday mornings.

Subj: Re:The Red Vorlon
Date: 96-05-16 15:41:11 EDT
From: DaveAtCWRU
Posted on: America Online

<< interludes spoilerspace inserted>>

 

 

 

 
“What’d the red ship do?”
You mean the Rascally Red Rammer? The one that paralyzed a Shadow ship with some sort of beam and then rammed the sucker? I thought that was the red one, wasn’t it?

Subj: Re: Summer episodes
Date: 96-05-16 20:28:22 EDT
From: BIL509
Posted on: America Online

After War Without End II airs, how long do we have to wait for new eps., next fall? If any one knows, please tell me.

Bill

Subj: More I & E comments
Date: 96-05-16 20:36:26 EDT
From: UFO5441
Posted on: America Online

I’m gonna assume Jms at B5 really IS J Michael. If so, hello, many thanks for a wonderful season and for seasons yet to come.

Rosalind wrote
>> Who’s going to run Medlab with Franklin’s resignation?

Good question. Maybe the female doctor who’s name I can’t recall will run the place.

To SPLEENEX (I don’t mean to start an argument, heaven forbid): I’ll take the Star-Drek comment with a grain of salt, since I enjoy both shows/universes immensely.

Quite a few technical difficulties regarding VCR’s this past week. Almost makes you want to believe in higher powers, albeit malicious ones. As for Londo, I say again, he looked pretty convinced to me. I think his serious anti-Morden behavior earlier in the show was a teaser of sorts, since in the end he is right back on the road to ruin. Can’t wait to see how that relationship pans out in the final reckoning.

Chris

Subj: Speculation-Londo Prophecy
Date: 96-05-16 21:15:02 EDT
From: Araknis88
Posted on: America Online

Spoilers for “War Without End, Part I”
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I never really bought the theory that Lord Refa was the one Londo would kill who was already dead (remember the prophecy made by the Emperor’s widow earlier this season?). After seeing WWE, I now think it could be Sheridan. In a sense, Sheridan kind of died when the time stabilizer or whatever it was called broke. And then, the first thing Londo says when he sees him is that it’s time for him to die. Anyone also think this is possible? Am I just crazy (probably…)?

Subj: Re:Speculation-Londo Prophec
Date: 96-05-16 21:35:32 EDT
From: GBCRUSHER
Posted on: America Online

There are plenty of nominees for the one who is already dead don’t you think?

We have as has been said

Sheridan (I haven’t seen WWE yet) but your probably right.
Kosh who alot of people I know are speculating he’s still alive somehow.
and finally we have Morden (on my list anyway) who is reportedly dead according to Earth Force records from going to Za’ha’dum (sorry about the spelling)

Subj: Tapes Needed
Date: 96-05-16 23:21:48 EDT
From: RabLib
Posted on: America Online

I don’t really know were the right place to post this is, so don’t kill me.
If anyone can send me the tapes of the first two seasons of B5, please e-mail me.
thanx,
tirtzah:)

Subj: Re:I & E & Bab5
Date: 96-05-17 00:12:30 EDT
From: DaveShufon
Posted on: America Online

<<This is about the image shown right before Kosh dies. I saw it as a ship (can’t tell if it’s babylon 5) being sucked into something-it looked to me like the ship was moving, not the light. I can’t for the life of me figure this out-is it Bab5 (or Bab4, for that matter)? Another ship entirely? Is it being destroyed or saved? What does Kosh have to do with it? What does it all MEEEAAANNN?>>

It wasn’t a ship being sucked into something, it was a surge of white energy streaming over B5. If you taped the episode you can watch it again and see that it’s clearly Babylon 5.

Subj: Re:Spoiler WWE One/Speculati
Date: 96-05-17 03:45:35 EDT
From: Archer C1
Posted on: America Online

SPOILER

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

<While rewatching WWEI my friend noticed something rather interesting. In Ivonovas audio-only warning from the future she says Earth Alliance Station B5…as opposed to the later visual warning where she only says B5.

Just maybe they are not the same future. Maybe if B4 is stollen as before the future turns out failry badely aswell…….>

Yeah but she was wearing the Mibari/Ranger uniform, not an EA uniform, so enough is the same…

Subj: Re:Spoiler WWE One/Speculati
Date: 96-05-17 03:51:25 EDT
From: Archer C1
Posted on: America Online

SPOILER

 

 

 

 
One reaction to WWE. Holy cats!!!

After Severed Dream, I thought “JMS can’t top this!”
After Interludes, I thought, “Well, I know he can’t top THIS!”
After tonight, I’ve given up evening trying to guess how good this will get…go baby, go…

Subj: B4 fought the 1st Shadow War
Date: 96-05-17 10:38:59 EDT
From: IJE2
Posted on: America Online

Spoiler!!!

 

 

 

 

 

WOW! Just when you thought it couldn’t get any better! My question is this though…

What exactly is the role of the rangers? They can’t fight the shadows.
Subj: Re:B4 fought the 1st Shadow
Date: 96-05-17 12:39:24 EDT
From: Archer C1
Posted on: America Online

SPOILER

 

 

 

 
<What exactly is the role of the rangers? They can’t fight the shadows.>

Not yet…

Subj: Legendary Love Story
Date: 96-05-17 13:31:07 EDT
From: BARRIEJ
Posted on: America Online

(has slight spoiler for WWOE 1)

 
warning

 

A couple of weeks ago I had broached the idea (in the Delenn/Sheridan topic area) that Delenn may have confided her feelings about John to Sinclair (before he went time traveling). Now that Sinclair is gone through time and is most likely Valen (see “Legends” topic area for more info on Valen) I’m still of the opinion that they did talk about her love for John. She certainly saw him on Minbar several times, according to the offical B5 comics sanctioned by JMS as being part of the epic arc. Here’s why:

The comics have established that Delenn & Sinclair met (at least once if not more) while he was an Ambassador to Minbar. Also, JMS has said they are very close friends (but not romantically). Valen established several prophecies, among them at least three about Delenn: her metamorphis into a human/Minbari, her “fated” love for another and her leadership in the coming war. Of course in “our” time the prophecies are well known to the Minbari, so if he wanted, Sinclair didn’t really have to do much creative thinking here, just parrot what he’s been told.

Yet I’ve had this feeling (ever since Lennier’s statement about her fate) that the prophecies had an eye-witness quality to them and wondered if Delenn would go back in time too. She’s quite an impressive person and could easily be legendary in any era. But as an anthropologist I believe that a story has to resonate with someone in order to become a legend. What do you remember about Napoleon? I think of the March on Moscow and that he and Josephine were a hot item. Those two facets of his life have survived as a legend because they were very real parts of the person that touched people in his lifetime so that they kept these aspects alive.

Her story had to make an impact on someone in the past in order to take root in the culture. Her transformation and leadership role (at the time Sinclair went bye-bye) would be well-known among the Minbari, but her love of John would not. She would have to have unburdended her heart to Sinclair for him to know her story well enough so he could be the “eye-witness.” Then the strength of his connection to her could make the story come alive so that it will be legendary for a thousand years.

Sinclair, being a good friend to Delenn, would want this woman to find some peace and resolution in her life and new role. He’d know first hand of her leadership and her transformation, but unless she said something, he could only speculate what the “fated” part was about. Did she talk to him about John? If he knew she loved John he’d be supportive of her and would want her to be happy. When watching WWOE 1, when Sinclair smiles at Delenn & John holding hands, I had my confirmation! His look was one of knowing and unconditional support for her.

This could be the clincher that makes her life and love real enough for him that he becomes the “eye-witness” to make prophecies that will last a thousand years.
Subj: Re:Speculation-Londo Prophec
Date: 96-05-17 14:54:03 EDT
From: Araknis88
Posted on: America Online

<<There are plenty of nominees for the one who is already dead don’t you think?
Sheridan (I haven’t seen WWE yet) but your probably right.
Kosh who alot of people I know are speculating he’s still alive somehow.
and finally we have Morden (on my list anyway) who is reportedly dead according to Earth Force records from going to Za’ha’dum (sorry about the spelling)>>

I doubt JMS would bring Kosh back to life (it would destroy the power of his death), but Morden makes perfect sense. I had never even thought of him…

Subj: Spoiler WWE1 -Who is Merlin?
Date: 96-05-17 23:41:43 EDT
From: Theodosial
Posted on: America Online

Spoiler for WWE1…
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After watching WWE, Part 1, I have a new candidate for who Merlin is – Zathras!

Merlin knew the future because he traveled backwards in time – poor Zathras seems be doing the same! – Zathras’ experiences in Babylon Squared takes place after his experiences in WWE Part 1, and there is a hint that he knows future events involving Sheridan (“Zathras not remember. If Zathras remember, he will tell you”).

I predict we will see (a young?) Zathras one more time after WWE.
Subj: Re:Dukat’s death
Date: 96-05-18 01:32:36 EDT
From: Yeenorm
Posted on: America Online

Plus, there was enough time for the Soul Hunters to be in the vicintiy to try and
take Dukhat’s soul.

norm

Subj: Re:Speculation-Londo Prophecy
Date: 96-05-18 01:45:02 EDT
From: Its a myth
Posted on: America Online

WWE1
Spoiler space
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Yep. I think you’re right about Sheridan being the one who’s already dead, but for a slightly different reason. I don’t think coming unstuck-in-time makes Sheridan “dead” (and am I the only one expecting to see Billy Pilgrim show up?). However, from the point of view of Emporer Londo, Sheridan may already be dead–he may have died in that future Londo’s past. (Does this make sense? I can’t seem to really convey it too well.) The unstuck Sheridan would then very much be the man who is already dead.

Subj: Re:I & E & Bab5
Date: 96-05-18 03:25:27 EDT
From: LatCrow
Posted on: America Online

Possible Spoiler down below

 

 

 

 

 

 

 
Hasn’t anybody figured out that the Vorlons are a hive-mind? “We are all Kosh” pretty much gives it away. For a good example of the TYPE of hive-mind I mean I refer you to C.S.Friedman’s
“The Madness Season” or the cho-ja of Kelewan in Raymond Feist’s Riftwar series–The Empire Trilogy in particular. They are both one and many.

Subj: Re:B4 fought the 1st Shadow
Date: 96-05-18 04:17:28 EDT
From: Jms at B5
Posted on: America Online

The role of the rangers so far has been to monitor the frontiers and keep an eye on the shadows; they will get an added role by the end of this season.

jms
Subj: Re:SD – Best One Yet!!!!
Date: 96-05-18 10:34:18 EDT
From: EAberneth
Posted on: America Online

Yes, I know, but did you see the look of utter defeat on Sheridan’s face when it was announence
that there were four jump points forming right on top of them. Then his complete relief and determination on his face when he found out it was Delenn to the rescue? I thought that was utterly priceless.

Subj: Re:Morden’s head
Date: 96-05-18 14:13:53 EDT
From: C12kyd
Posted on: America Online

Could be that He is not as highly ranked as first thought or depicted…..

Subj: Re:I & E & Bab5
Date: 96-05-18 14:20:30 EDT
From: C12kyd
Posted on: America Online

Don’t be too sure that’s its 5 it might be 4….

Subj: Re:WWE discussions
Date: 96-05-18 15:04:18 EDT
From: Dolby1000
Posted on: America Online

Possible spoilers, so I’ll add my thoughts below
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In the past the contained Invanova’s message, and Garibaldi’s fire fight, anyone notice who was still on the station? Sinclair. Apparaently, the altered past did not find Sheridan on the station. What role did he play in this past, or was it one of none at all.
Sheridan in Londo’s future: Here, Londo is finally the emporer. OF a destroyed world. Even though he blames Sheridan for fighting his (Sheridan’s war), has Londo forgotten his ugly role in it? It appears he does not “see the light” of his past actions. Also, earlier we saw a flashback seen (in year one or two) that showed an old G’Kar and Londo still fighting. Is this to come next week (Pure speculation). But, if it does, and Londo is killed in the future, does Vir then take over? And lead Centari Prime in a new direction, after re-building it?
I can’t week until next week to see how right this is, but I though it was interesting speculation.

Subj: Re:Speculation-Londo Prophec
Date: 96-05-18 18:57:30 EDT
From: Wolfworth
Posted on: America Online

Sheradon? Yes, it could fit. I thought Morden the “already dead” possibility until WWE1.

However…Morella’s Prophecy states the third action Londo must take: “…you must surrender yourself to your greatest fear, knowing that it will destroy you.”

If we assume Londo will fail the second opportunity by killing the one who is already dead, then surrendering to his greatest fear is the only way left to avoid the “fire” that awaits him at the end of his journey.

…just more for us to think about.

wolfworth

 

Subj: WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHH!!!!!!
Date: 96-05-18 19:13:26 EDT
From: MichaelF2
Posted on: America Online

I came home and turned on my videotape of Babylon 5 that I recorded today and discovered that I had set the timer to record it from 3:55 pm to 4:05 pm NOT 5:05 pm. So I only recorded the first 5 minutes. WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHH!!!
I’m so upset. :((((((((((((((((((((( and it looked like it was an important episode too. I’m off to cry myself to sleep now.

Subj: WWE1
Date: 96-05-18 20:49:19 EDT
From: MythoPhile
Posted on: America Online

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I too am confused about the future Sheridan’s in. Presumably it can’t be the “alternate” future because we won the shadow war, which Delenn said was impossible. So it must be the “real” future, as Delenn called it – the “we did all we’re supposed to” future. So Londo’s fate is locked in, then? And considering that the war’s supposed to end in the next couple years (I gather?) those fires on Centauri Prime have been burning for QUITE awhile. Talk about your slow firemen. (Maybe the fires outside the capital have the lowest priority?!?) Frankly, I don’t like the idea that all these wonderful prophecies we’ve seen so far only happen in some unreal “alternate” future that was never going to be and never will be. Okay, Ivanova & crew could “fake” the messages from the in-trouble B4 to happen on schedule… but what about the scene with Garibaldi’s last hurrah… where Sinclair is there (lookin’ young). Sinclair seems to think that’s the alternate future. Or is it taking place on B4’s last hurrah, under the assumption that G. went back too? No, that can’t be right, because the Sinclair in the same scene was young-looking, and by then he’d be old. Don’t see how all this is gonna work out, but JMS’ writing so far seems leagues above the Trek “time-paradox-anything-can-happen-don’t-try-to-figure-it-out” kinda stuff.
BTW, it’s been a long time since I’ve seen B^2 (can’t think why), but should Garibaldi remember that vision of the firefight? I thought that was Sinclair’s vision.

Subj: Re:I and E: No spoilers
Date: 96-05-18 22:19:25 EDT
From: Cybskunk
Posted on: America Online

Liked the touch at the beginning, with Dr. Franklin shooting up to Ivanova’s voice-over of “We all seem to be handling it pretty well…”

Subj: Re:WWE1
Date: 96-05-18 23:23:45 EDT
From: GBCRUSHER
Posted on: America Online

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Do you honestly believe that Garibaldi is just going to sit around on B5 after gettting that message from Sinclair? I doubt that Sinclair wanted Garibaldi to unscramble it so quickly. Maybe Garibaldi will go and try to stop Sinclair from doing what he’s doing. Of course he’s going to fail, after all Sinclair is the person who wrote the letters to himself and Delenn about stealing B4 in the first place.

What I want to know is how will Sheridan get back home, I doubt that JMS is just going to leave him floating around in the future with Londo & G’Kar while the war continues. Maybe Sinclair will take a detour to the future before going back 1000 years to the last Shadow War.

Subj: Re:I & E & Bab5
Date: 96-05-18 23:59:14 EDT
From: StoOdin101
Posted on: America Online

 

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OK enough of that…
>>>>Hasn’t anybody figured out that the Vorlons are a hive-mind? “We are all Kosh” pretty much gives it away.<<<<<

Yes, I figured that out…or else Kosh is not a name, but a title, like “vorlon who goes among lesser races”…and if so, then any “ambassador” they would get could be called Kosh.
If they are a hive mind, watch as JMS does what the idiots at Star Trek Central failed to do with the Borg: get the “Group MInd” concept RIGHT for once. No “other names” (like Locutus, for example), no other personality, if you speak to one, you are speaking to them all, and all of them have the same thoughts at the same time.
Subj: Re:Speculation-Londo Prophec
Date: 96-05-19 01:19:14 EDT
From: Frogzila
Posted on: America Online

Lord Refa could also qualify as the person who is already dead. He already has poison coursing through his veins. Plus He isnt really high on Londo’s friend list right now.
Kevin
Subj: Re:Morden’s head
Date: 96-05-19 01:31:47 EDT
From: Kmegn
Posted on: America Online

Noooooo. The feeling I had looking at Morden was that he was watching in FASCINATION, the way some little kids look when they’re tearing the wings off of flies or burning anthills with a magnifying glass. *I* was the one who was horrified. I have to admit (albeit reluctantly) that I’ve always thought Morden was cute and possibly redeemable as a character. Needless to say, I don’t think that anymore….

Subj: Re:I & E & Bab5
Date: 96-05-19 01:49:08 EDT
From: Kmegn
Posted on: America Online

<<Yes, I figured that out…or else Kosh is not a name, but a title, like “vorlon who goes among lesser races”…and if so, then any “ambassador” they would get could be called Kosh.>>

Sort of like “Christ”, huh? Hmmmmm…..

Subj: Re:I & E & Bab5
Date: 96-05-19 02:08:29 EDT
From: DaveShufon
Posted on: America Online

<<Don’t be too sure that’s its 5 it might be 4….>>

Haven’t you seen Babylon 4? The two don’t exactly look alike! B4 is about twice the size, has a MUCH larger diameter, has counter-rotating sections, has green tones instead of blue tones, and has its cooling fins configured like rays coming out from the back of the station (instead of just straight up and down like B5). If you watch the scene again you’ll see that it’s Babylon 5 that the energy wave passes over, not Babylon 4.

Subj: Re:WWE1
Date: 96-05-19 02:36:47 EDT
From: DaveShufon
Posted on: America Online

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<<I too am confused about the future Sheridan’s in. Presumably it can’t be the “alternate” future because we won the shadow war, which Delenn said was impossible. So it must be the “real” future, as Delenn called it – the “we did all we’re supposed to” future. So Londo’s fate is locked in, then?>>

Of course it can be an “alternate future”. All futures are alternate futures, even the ones that actually happen. They are all alternates *until* they happen. This has been stated many times throughout the show. By the Lady Ladira back in “Signs and Portents” – she told Sincair that her vision of the B5 exploding was only a possible future, that the future is never written until it happens. The Lady Morella said essentially the same thing. The only thing she said was definite was that Londo and Vir would both be emperors. Delenn has said a couple of times that prophecy is a poor guide.

This is exactly why it’s so important to make sure they get B4 back in time. So as to avoid the future they keep seeing where Babylon 5 is destroyed.

<<And considering that the war’s supposed to end in the next couple years (I gather?) those fires on Centauri Prime have been burning for QUITE awhile. Talk about your slow firemen. (Maybe the fires outside the capital have the lowest priority?!?)>>

Londo never said that the fires had been burning since the war! The war had ended long before this when Sheridan drove off the Shadows (at least in *this* future). But some of the races allied with the Shadows are still around and have come to Centauri Prime to wreak havoc. Maybe as payback for having turned their backs on the Shadows? (just a guess)

<<Frankly, I don’t like the idea that all these wonderful prophecies we’ve seen so far only happen in some unreal “alternate” future that was never going to be and never will be. Okay, Ivanova & crew could “fake” the messages from the in-trouble B4 to happen on schedule>>

They are not all only going to happen in a future that will never be. They are things that WILL happen if the characters do (or fail to do) certain things. Ivanova doesn’t need to fake any messages. Those messages are coming from a future which may or may not happen. In other words, with this time rift open they’re getting the opertunity to see down several different paths that the future might take. The trick is to avoid the more nasty paths!

<<but what about the scene with Garibaldi’s last hurrah… where Sinclair is there (lookin’ young). Sinclair seems to think that’s the alternate future. Or is it taking place on B4’s last hurrah, under the assumption that G. went back too? No, that can’t be right, because the Sinclair in the same scene was young-looking, and by then he’d be old.>>

My take on this, was that this is what would happen if the crew failed in going back in time to save Babylon 4. Had they failed, Sinclair would have found himself back on B5, and in 8 days the Shadows would have attacked and destroyed the station. Everything in the vision would have come to pass. But as long as Sinclair brings B4 back in time, and since he won’t ever be returning to B5, this future can’t happen. At least not like it did in the vision. Also, Garibaldi said the vision was of B5 being invaded.

<< BTW, it’s been a long time since I’ve seen B^2 (can’t think why), but should Garibaldi remember that vision of the firefight? I thought that was Sinclair’s vision.>>

It’s been stated elsewhere (I *think* by JMS, but I’m not sure), that both Sinclair AND Gaibaldi had that same vision while on B4.

Subj: Talia’s Lover (Ironheart)
Date: 96-05-19 11:16:08 EDT
From: Daemar4267
Posted on: America Online

Just saw something in another area and it made me remember something about Jason Ironheart. He was the PSI Corp telepath that was Talia’s lover and became something else because of PSI Corps experiments (first year?). Seems like to me he told Sinclair “I’ll see you again in a thousand years.” I thought he meant in the future, but now it seems he meant in the past.

I can’t tell you how many times B5 has sent shivers up and down my spine. What an excellent show!

Subj: Re:Speculation-Londo Prophec
Date: 96-05-19 13:29:08 EDT
From: Delennn
Posted on: America Online

 

 

 

 

 

 
What if the one who is already dead is Sheridan because, in WWEI, Ivonova said, “The Captain is dead…”
If Sheridan is traveling within that universe, whould’t it stand to reason that he is the one who is already dead?
Subj: Better & Better
Date: 96-05-19 16:19:51 EDT
From: Startrain
Posted on: America Online

Just saw WWE #1, B5 keeps getting better & better! I don’t know how JMS does it, but NO other show has ever captivated us like this!

Startain

Subj: Re:Morden’s head
Date: 96-05-19 17:04:17 EDT
From: SLV80
Posted on: America Online

I thought I saw a trace of sadness as he watched Kosh die – but this doesn’t necessarily mean that he regretted it. He always seemed to have much respect for Kosh and the Vorlons – perhaps that half second where he closed his eyes was in ackowledgement of a worthy opponent, a much honored enemy.
Or it could just be that that flash of greenish light we saw was too bright to look at, and he closed his eyes so he wouldn’t get blinded. Personally, I prefer the philosophical explanation, but life doesn’t always work like that.

Subj: Re:Speculation-Londo Prophec
Date: 96-05-19 18:12:40 EDT
From: Fidlr168
Posted on: America Online

So when does Elvis show up?

Subj: Re:WWE1
Date: 96-05-19 18:24:26 EDT
From: Fidlr168
Posted on: America Online

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Excellent show! Yes, I like ST, but B5 and Voyager air opposite on Sat. pm, and I find myself opting for B5, and skipping the ST video the next day. I started watching for the look of the show–so much richer than on any other sci-fi on tv. (and frankly, the first year was really hard to watch–so awkward). Very glad I stuck with the show, though. The writing gets better each episode, and the characters are comfortable now. Really nice work, jms!

Subj: Re: Summer episodes
Date: 96-05-19 19:09:18 EDT
From: ZARBOR
Posted on: America Online

Yes, the next new episodes after WW2 will be next fall: you can watch season 3 from the beginning after WW2

Subj: Sinclair, Ivanova, Garibaldi
Date: 96-05-19 21:24:36 EDT
From: Archer C1
Posted on: America Online

In the distress message, Ivanova says, “The Captain’s dead,” without mentioning a name. In Sinclair’s vision, he and Galibaldi are together as the Shadow’s storm the station.

Perhaps in the alternate timeline, Sinclair stays on the station, gets promoted and then gets killed between the time he leaves Garibaldi and Ivanova sends her message.

Or….Sheridan is still the Captain, and Sinclair returns from Minbar to assist in the final defense.

Note: kudos to CC for her performance on the distress message. Such total desperation and fear can’t be easy to play.

Subj: Re:Speculation-Londo Prophec
Date: 96-05-19 21:51:34 EDT
From: BETH509
Posted on: America Online

I think that the one who is allready dead is Londo, look at him in the future he looks like a tired man who has lost everything and has nothing to live for, who agrees with that idea?

Subj: Re:I remember when…
Date: 96-05-19 23:13:15 EDT
From: ProfPockts
Posted on: America Online

TO JMS and others who love the work he has done for us:

I remember several years ago (can’t remember just now) logging onto a BBS (remember THOSE days?!). I found a little note from some obscure film-maker to Commodore Amiga (Video Toaster) and SciFi folks.

Paraphrasing, he was talking about his latest project – the B5 pilot. He wanted us to write to stations to pick up the series. He went on about the twists and turns the plot would take. He said that he had a story to tell that would be well worth the watching. He said that he would make it all worth while. I doubted, I thought what bravado. I had never heard of him before and the pilot was good, but plot twists seemed awkward and too soap-oper-ish. In my heart I wished him luck, but knew it was too good to be true. I was wrong…

JMS has created the most consistent, most compelling, most, exciting hour on TV in decades (if ever before). B5 is without question, IMHO, the only show that truely has a story to tell and WANTS to tell if the sake of the audience.

JMS has my utter gratitude for (paraphrasing his old note) writing a SciFi show with no kids, and no cute robots, EVER! The weaponry comes across as diverse and unique to SciFi. The characters are, for the most part, are _less_ human, yet _more_ human than anything currently on TV.

JMS hinted at this world of work that he has created. JMS, did you _know_ where this would take you? Did you really see this level of detail, this magnitude of work? Whether you did or not, I applaud you (that seems trite), I bow to you — not in some silly sci-fi nut kinda why — because I’m not. As the most humble, sincere gesture I can think of, I want you to know that you’re hard work and incredible odds that you have/and are over-coming to tell us this fun and evocative story, have not gone unnoticed. We sincerely appreciate you and your efforts. You are showing yourself to be the Michelangelo of television.. and you are doing miracles with a medium that is largely full of empty, mindless programming.

You know, I doubt that I still have that old BBS note, but I’m going to look…

Todd

Subj: Re:Talia’s Lover (Ironheart)
Date: 96-05-19 23:36:50 EDT
From: DaveShufon
Posted on: America Online

<<Just saw something in another area and it made me remember something about Jason Ironheart. He was the PSI Corp telepath that was Talia’s lover and became something else because of PSI Corps experiments (first year?). Seems like to me he told Sinclair “I’ll see you again in a thousand years.” I thought he meant in the future, but now it seems he meant in the past.>>

Actually, he told Sinclair he’d see him again in a million years.

Subj: Re:Sinclair, Ivanova, Gariba
Date: 96-05-19 23:39:59 EDT
From: DaveShufon
Posted on: America Online

<<Perhaps in the alternate timeline, Sinclair stays on the station, gets promoted and then gets killed between the time he leaves Garibaldi and Ivanova sends her message.>>

Gets promoted by who? Remember, that by going to B5 he’s joined a group of rebels. Do you think Earthforce will promote him for that?

Subj: WWE1
Date: 96-05-19 23:45:42 EDT
From: J E BOMAN
Posted on: America Online

FANTASTIC SHOW!!!! I can not wait until next week to see the other half. It had me sitting on the edge of my seat the whole time. I can honestly say that the past 8-10 weeks have been the best episodes yet. JMS, Please keep up the good work. You can see that what you and your staff have been doing has been great. The B5 following is increasing in the central upstate NY area. We all love B5 here. Keep the fantastic episodes coming. Hope to see you next season. Have you heard anything yet? Love B5. Joanne

Subj: Re:WWE1 HELP
Date: 96-05-20 00:23:04 EDT
From: CCobb1
Posted on: America Online

I need HELP!!! Some asshole ramed the telephone pole near my home and the cable went out this weekend and therefore I did not get to see WWEpart 1!!!!!!!

I really need someone to send me a copy!!!! So that I do not have to wait 2 -3 weeks for the repeat!!

HELP ME B5 FANS!!!

Chuck CCobb1@aol.com

Subj: Re:WWI
Date: 96-05-20 01:18:17 EDT
From: CPamir
Posted on: America Online

The show was great. Couldn’t believe it.

One thing I would like to note, if the future is as shown, obviously B5 is doomed, and the war will be fought by B4. However, if the future can be changed, and what they saw is only a possibility, then the scene with Vice-President Clark planning the president’s death could also have been a possibility and not a fact.

One other note to mention is that the future that was shown was one where B5 was still with the Earth Alliance and hadn’t seceded, since Ivanova mentioned that the Earth Alliance Babylon 5 station was under attack.

One other last note to mention, it seems to that time travel if possible, would be very difficult, and highly unstable. It is possible that what the command crew of B5 is seeing is a mental image thrust upon them from the psychic powers of the mimbari, vorlons, and the ship.

To give credence to such a mirage, we saw it happen by Talia against Bester in the scene with the psychic underground railroad.

Why this would be done, I do not know yet, but it is a possibility.

Subj: Re:WWE1
Date: 96-05-20 04:42:08 EDT
From: Jms at B5
Posted on: America Online

No word yet on season four; won’t be along for a couple of weeks yet.

jms
Subj: Re:I remember when…
Date: 96-05-20 04:45:36 EDT
From: Jms at B5
Posted on: America Online

Todd: thank you. Yes, I always saw that the story would have these massive twists and turns, the way any good novel does. It’s something that had to be done, and we’ve done it, and we intend to keep on doing it until the story’s told.

And I don’t blame you for doubting initially; SF television is full of great claims that end up being so much balloon-juice. I’ve heard them endlessly as a fan myself. Which is why I felt I *had* to do it right.

jms
Subj: Re:I remember when…
Date: 96-05-20 14:04:04 EDT
From: ZenGEOS
Posted on: America Online

>>

Perhaps in the alternate timeline, Sinclair stays on the station, gets promoted and then gets killed between the time he leaves Garibaldi and Ivanova sends her message.

<<

I kinda lean toward the following:

Sinclair, in B2, I think, got the switcharoo…or something, got warped to and back from the future while B4 was phasing in and out. So.. the ALTERNATE Future Sinclair came back from the future with the memories of how the future was for him. Hence he flashed back to the fall of B5.

Now Sinclair is going back to the earlier Shadow War to help lead that fight and ensure HIS future never comes to be.

Mark-
Subj: Re:Sinclair, Ivanova, Gariba
Date: 96-05-20 14:15:39 EDT
From: Archer C1
Posted on: America Online

<Gets promoted by who? Remember, that by going to B5 he’s joined a group of rebels. Do you think Earthforce will promote him for that?>

Well there’s about a year and half between the time Sheridan took over in the “real” timeline and the break with Earth. If Sinclair had not been transfered, he could have been promote anytime in that period.

Subj: Re:I remember when…
Date: 96-05-20 14:29:57 EDT
From: Archer C1
Posted on: America Online

<Sinclair, in B2, I think, got the switcharoo…or something, got warped to and back from the future while B4 was phasing in and out. So.. the ALTERNATE Future Sinclair came back from the future with the memories of how the future was for him. Hence he flashed back to the fall of B5.>

Mine is a hell of a lot simpler to follow

Subj: Re:I & E & Bab5
Date: 96-05-20 16:29:30 EDT
From: Davida TN
Posted on: America Online

<<This is about the image shown right before Kosh dies. I saw it as a ship (can’t tell if it’s babylon 5) being sucked into something-it looked to me like the ship was moving, not the light. I can’t for the life of me figure this out-is it Bab5 (or Bab4, for that matter)? Another ship entirely? Is it being destroyed or saved? What does Kosh have to do with it?
It wasn’t a ship being sucked into something, it was a surge of white energy streaming over B5. If you taped the episode you can watch it again and see that it’s clearly Babylon 5.>>

Speculating that this white energy is actually Kosh’s spirit spreading itself throughout B5 — to be called on, when needed again — only its artifacts left B5 in its ship… any thoughts?

Subj: Re:I & E & Bab5
Date: 96-05-20 19:04:42 EDT
From: DelanySis1
Posted on: America Online

By George, the light IS moving, not the ship! Thanks for helping me figure this out!

Now-where did Sinclair get that scar on his cheek?

Subj: Re:Morden’s head
Date: 96-05-20 20:44:51 EDT
From: SarahACnnr
Posted on: America Online

What I noticed was that he closed his eyes, but I couldn’t tell if it was because he couldn’t take it or what.

Also, did anyone else notice that Morden left alone? He had to open the door for the shadows to get in in the first place, but they didn’t exit with him. Did Kosh kill them even as he died?

I think of Morden as the “mouth of Sauron” from Tolkien.
Subj: Re:Morden’s head
Date: 96-05-20 21:17:58 EDT
From: Badinov
Posted on: America Online

>> Did Kosh kill them even as he died?<<

I seem to recall reading a post from JMS that said something to the effect that Kosh died hard – took a bunch of the little space vermin down with him.

My question:
why didn’t a Starfury squadron render Ambassadorial honors (missing man formation) when the Vorlon ship did its viking funeral dive into the heart of the star?
Badinov

Subj: Re:Morden’s head
Date: 96-05-20 21:24:15 EDT
From: Sandie M R
Posted on: America Online

<<My question:
why didn’t a Starfury squadron render Ambassadorial honors (missing man formation) when the Vorlon ship did its viking funeral dive into the heart of the star?>>

Since they want to keep Kosh’s death a secret, performing that ceremonial would be pretty counter-productive, wouldn’t it?

Subj: Re:Sinclair, Ivanova, Gariba
Date: 96-05-20 21:57:19 EDT
From: DaveShufon
Posted on: America Online

<<Well there’s about a year and half between the time Sheridan took over in the “real” timeline and the break with Earth. If Sinclair had not been transfered, he could have been promote anytime in that period.>>

But Sinclair *was* transferred. This vision wasn’t about something that could have happened if Sinclair didn’t leave. It’s about what WILL happen in 8 days if they’re not successful in saving B4 and bringing it into the past. Because if this doesn’t happen then the Shadows will be three times as strong, and there will be no stopping them.

Subj: Re:cc’s performance
Date: 96-05-20 22:56:33 EDT
From: BPowell170
Posted on: America Online

I agree — that disaster sequence, or any “mad scene” is really tough to play. Christian was brilliant.

Subj: Re:I remember when…
Date: 96-05-20 22:57:57 EDT
From: BPowell170
Posted on: America Online

Todd — If you find that note, please post it. I know I’d love to read it, as would many other B5-ers.

— barb

Subj: Re:WWI
Date: 96-05-20 22:59:40 EDT
From: BPowell170
Posted on: America Online
Good ears — I didn’t catch the “Earth Alliance B5.” That for sure makes it the alternate future.

— barb

Subj: War Without End II
Date: 96-05-20 23:19:41 EDT
From: ZED30
Posted on: America Online

SPOILERS BEYOND BELIEF

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 
WOW!!!!!

Okay, grand statement ahead… At this point I officially declare Babylon5 the best SF project ever committed to film or tape.

I am simply blown away. I never would have guessed the identity of “The One.” What beautiful symmetry (well, I guess its actually hard to have 3-sided symetry). The show has a sense of fulfillment about it now. This episode seems to mark the end of the first half of the show while opening up the second half (please whatever Gods I worship there must be a second half). We have answers to so many questions but now we have so many new questions.

Gee. Anyway, major congrats to JMS and all involved. I think Babylon 5 just became my favorite TV show ever.

Subj: Re: Metaphor for Zathros
Date: 96-05-20 23:42:18 EDT
From: MReavis
Posted on: America Online

Zathros is really Bob Dole. Ever notice how they refer to themselves in the third person?

Zathros no be senator no more. Zathros want to be your president. Vote for Zathros!

Subj: Re:Sinclair, Ivanova, Gariba
Date: 96-05-21 13:21:27 EDT
From: Archer C1
Posted on: America Online

I am only going to say this once:

If you change what happened a thousand years ago, that can change a lot of things. Maybe the Earth-Mimbari War went differently. Maybe Sheridan wasn’t a war hero, so he didn’t get command of Babylon 5. Maybe, with a different outcome to the war, Sinclair isn’t sent to Mimbar…

Let’s face it…according to WWE and B2, Sinclair is present on B5 when the Shadows destroy the station. The above explanation is simpler than any other I’ve heard.

Okay?

Subj: Re:I & E & Bab5
Date: 96-05-21 14:00:31 EDT
From: C12kyd
Posted on: America Online

Thanks Dave…

Subj: time loop
Date: 96-05-21 14:05:18 EDT
From: C12kyd
Posted on: America Online

AAAAAUUUUUUUUUUUUHHHHHHHGGGGGGGGGG!!!!!!!!!! We’re caught in a time loop and can’t get out ! ! ! Lost forever living our lives over and over and over again………………..

Subj: Re:time loop`
Date: 96-05-21 18:49:02 EDT
From: Badinov
Posted on: America Online

>>AAAAAUUUUUUUUUUUUHHHHHHHGGGGGGGGGG!!!!!!!!!! We’re caught in a time loop and can’t get out ! ! ! Lost forever living our lives over and over and over again………………..<<

What’s the Minbari translation of “Groundhog Day”?

:-)

Subj: distress call WWE 1
Date: 96-05-21 21:50:07 EDT
From: RosalindB
Posted on: America Online

Possible spoiler……
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hope this is enough…

I noticed a similarity between Ivanova’s distress call and one in a STNG episode. I forget the name, but Worf found himself in alternate timelines. In one of the final scenes, all the alternate Enterprises pop up. One of the ships was attacked by the Borg, and Riker pleads not to be sent back to his timeline. “We’re the last ship left…”
It was pretty eerie.

Subj: Re:WWI
Date: 96-05-22 00:21:58 EDT
From: LoudonB
Posted on: America Online

Yes, Ivonova did say Earth Alliance Station B5, but she was wearing the new uniform. Perhaps she said it simply as a routine, because the traumatic situation was preventing clear thought.

LoudonB

Subj: Re:Spoiler WWE One/Speculati
Date: 96-05-22 02:39:32 EDT
From: DaveAtCWRU
Posted on: America Online

You really thought WWE was that good? I thought it was good, but not spectacular, at least the first half anyway. Maybe it’s the hangover talking, but I’ve seen better episodes.
Subj: WarW/Out end 1-JMS question
Date: 96-05-22 03:48:06 EDT
From: Doc Hooch
Posted on: America Online

…..Hmmmmm

 

 

 

Time travel? This is one of the hardest genres to write believably…..I was a little disappointed with War Without End One,,, but Of course I need to reserve my judgment until I see part II ….”suspension of disbelief” is of course integral to any sci-fi… time travel sci fi seems the hardest to write believably….JMS, or anybody else, have you read anything by John Varley? On the time travel topic his novel is Millenium…but read Steel Beach — one of the best books I’ve ever read — sci fi or not. I’m sure you’ve all read the Tolkien trilogy — JMS just wondering if and when you read the Middle Earth saga — I read it when I was ten years old — it has to be an inspiration to any would-be writers as the ultimate good vs. evil fantasy… Any thoughts??
Also, JMS, if you would be so kind to answer, in your original writings for B5, how did it start? Did you just start typing away like a madman, or were you more systematic? Just love the show and would be happy to hear from you…..

Subj: WWE2 :attn JMS
Date: 96-05-22 14:02:56 EDT
From: RTerry9267
Posted on: America Online

Wow, Wow, and double Wow again. Thanks for tieing up some loose ends and not leaving before unraveling some new ones. I’m looking forward to the promised twists coming up.

When this project is over and done with (sigh…) I believe strongly that B5 will take its place in the halls of the Classics of Sci-fi with Star Wars and Star Trek (the other two most influential sci-fi flics of our time) . Be prepared JMS for some low creativity rip-offs in the future. Don’t fret though because I hear that when people copy you it should be taken as a great conpliment.

Keep us posted on the renewal of the 4th season. We’re doin’ all we can to help.

Ron

Subj: Re:Sinclair, Ivanova, Gariba
Date: 96-05-22 16:54:58 EDT
From: MShan15048
Posted on: America Online

The explanation doesn’t need to be complex.

They are told when they see the records of the first Shadow War and of White Star saving B4, that they still had the choice of following through.

If they don’t go, save B4, then steal it, B5 will be destroyed in 8 days.

So, let’s say they don’t go through with the mission. In that time line, Sinclair is still on B5 when the shadows start attacking, and, in fact, has put on his old service uniform. Sheridan is killed in the initial assault — “the Captain is dead.” Ivanova is in the control center, cut off by the damage from what’s happening where Garibaldi and Sinclair are fighting the actual assaults and doesn’t know their situation, so is “in charge” as far as she knows. Garibaldi has rigged the reactor, wants Sinclair to leave because he has still set up his network that could save the rest of the universe. Sinclair finally agrees, and leaves just in time as Ivanova is killed in the attack, whether Garibaldi blows the reactor or not.

Basically, Sinclair acts, until the White Star is committed in time, like a man who must do things in just a certain way, as if the letter told him what he had done before. Doing things this way may not be the best or only way to have them done, only the sure way to have the same conclusion as when it was done the first time. Thus, he cannot speak directly to Garibaldi, who must not come on the mission, Ivanova and Sheridan must do their thing, and (having only seen part one) he seems confident in saying Sheridan will be OK, and tells DeLenn, “I know what is to happen,” or words to that effect.

Thus, when he has his flashback of leaving B5 as it blows, and says to the retreating fighter with Garibaldi aboard, “Goodbye, old friend, I’ll make sure that won’t happen,” he’s basically saying he vows to keep to the “Script” he’s following.

Subj: Re:I & E & Bab5
Date: 96-05-22 18:18:12 EDT
From: RabLib
Posted on: America Online

Jms said that Sinclair (sp?) recieved the scar while training rangers/as a ranger on Membari.
—Tirtzah:)

Subj: WW2 spoiler
Date: 96-05-22 22:29:53 EDT
From: Allelujah
Posted on: America Online

spoiler space

 

 

 

 

 

 

 
what a wonderful way to leave me feeling like i learned alot, yet hungry to learn more. did delenn make it to the ship after sheridan quit sticking 17 years in the future? how old is david? Cyber (my son) wants to know how the Vorlons got on board b4 before the membari. and if the membari wouldn’t accept a human, why did they accept zathras? londo calling g’kar old friend? who are the we that all have keepers? how many different kinds of creatures work with or are shadows, anyway (i’ve seen at least 3)? and zathras promises that when the story of the one ends, it leads to a greater story! cyber also thinks zathras ends up building the great machine on epsilon. and there’s always some purpose for tachyon beams!
keep it coming, jms! 3 in one? what a concept…….

Subj: Re:WarW/Out end 1-JMS questi
Date: 96-05-22 23:51:13 EDT
From: DaveAtCWRU
Posted on: America Online
>…..Hmmmmm

 

 

 

>Time travel? This is one of the hardest genres to write believably…..I was a little disappointed >with War Without End One,,, but Of course I need to reserve my judgment until I see part II >….”suspension of disbelief” is of course integral to any sci-fi… time travel sci fi seems the >hardest to write believably….JMS, or anybody else, have you read anything by John Varley? On >the time travel topic his novel is Millenium…but read Steel Beach — one of the best books I’ve >ever read — sci fi or not. I’m sure you’ve all read the Tolkien trilogy — JMS just wondering if and

read Steel Beach. loved Steel Beach.
Subj: B5 1st to present seasom
Date: 96-05-23 04:56:50 EDT
From: Dolane
Posted on: America Online

JMS at B5
This is my first posting. I have been amazed at the true growth of the series and the separate storylines which continue to twist and turn. There are episodes which stand so well on their own. I liked your work on Twilight Zone also. I was ticked when CBS yanked it without a fair chance. I’ m happy that you got B5 off and running and running. Boxleitner and Furlan do have great chemistry, but your words make it happen. I’ll stop gushing over now and wait for more of the adventure to unfold.
Dolane

Subj: Re:Morden’s head
Date: 96-05-23 23:29:16 EDT
From: Wolfworth
Posted on: America Online

Yes, I notised that too. Perhaps we have a soul remaining in Morden.

GW

Subj: Re:B5 1st to present seasom
Date: 96-05-24 02:04:05 EDT
From: Jms at B5
Posted on: America Online

Dolane: thanks….

jms
Subj: Re:WarW/Out end 1-JMS questi
Date: 96-05-24 04:35:17 EDT
From: Doc Hooch
Posted on: America Online

Yes, Steel Beach was one of the best books I’ve ever read

Subj: WWE, P-2, Question
Date: 96-05-24 10:25:37 EDT
From: ANG n DEB
Posted on: America Online

Spoiler space:
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Ok, in one scene Delenn has a flash-forward. John is asleep in bed (I assume they are married now) she stands near the door holding a glass “snowball” (or whatever you want to call them). The door opens, behind Delenn you see the shadow of the person at the door, a female voice says one word (hello, I think), and Delenn looks scared and drops the glass ball.

Did I miss something? Did anyone recognize that voice? Or is this something that will come back in a future episode?

Thanks for any insight

deb

Subj: Re:WWE2
Date: 96-05-24 12:19:04 EDT
From: DSNOLTE
Posted on: America Online

After nearly 35 years of television watching, I’m now quite spoiled. B5 has raised the bar for dramatic television series (ANY drama, not just sci-fi) because of its noveloid storyline. The attention I’ve given to the show in the past has been rewarded like I would never have dared hope a TV program could. Even those things my cronies and I saw coming happened in a way we did not expect. Time and again our jaws were on the carpet, and our tiny minds were boggling big-time.

JMS, if Emmy nominations are not in your future because of audience size or some other political crap, rest assured that you have created the most impressive continuing dramatic presentation ever broadcast.

And, the last scene?….With a zinger like that, I just may be able to survive the summer waiting for what’s next.

It sure would be nice to pass the time building StarFury models though……………..

Subj: Re:WWE, P-2, Question
Date: 96-05-24 14:55:48 EDT
From: GARNET1195
Posted on: America Online

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>>>>Ok, in one scene Delenn has a flash-forward. John is asleep in bed (I assume they are married now) she stands near the door holding a glass “snowball” (or whatever you want to call them). The door opens, behind Delenn you see the shadow of the person at the door, a female voice says one word (hello, I think), and Delenn looks scared and drops the glass ball.

Did I miss something? Did anyone recognize that voice? Or is this something that will come back in a future episode?<<<<

May be Anne Sheridan comes back!!

If so it would provide a great moral conflict for John. After all “Those who would not serve were killed.” Still she would still be his beloved wife…

Just a thought.

-garnet

 

Subj: Flashback scenes in “WWEI&2″
Date: 96-05-24 18:06:22 EDT
From: SwiftyP
Posted on: America Online

I missed the first season of B5 — hey, I didn’t know, OKAY! — were the flashback scenes in “WWE I” actually from “Babylon^2″ — specifically the one with Garibaldi fighting the Shadows?

Swifty
Subj: Re:Flashback scenes in “WWEI
Date: 96-05-24 18:23:39 EDT
From: DaveShufon
Posted on: America Online

<<I missed the first season of B5 — hey, I didn’t know, OKAY! — were the flashback scenes in “WWE I” actually from “Babylon^2″ — specifically the one with Garibaldi fighting the Shadows?

Swifty>>

Yes, this scene was in “Babylon Squared”.

Subj: Re:WWE II–SPOILER
Date: 96-05-24 18:36:55 EDT
From: Dolby1000
Posted on: America Online

Spoiler below, wait untul you hve seen part two before proceeding
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I have just got to believe the voice at the door is Sheridan’s wife. There just is no one else (we have met yet) who could produce such a re-action from Delenn.
One part of the episode was a little confusing, but I think I got it, that is,
Why did Delenn put on Sheridans suit? Was it just pure sacrifice for her loved one? Was she doing it to save Sheridan’s live over her own? I can believe that, but I don’t think it was all that clear in the episode. Nothing she did afterword showed why she did it. I am not always as quick at these things as other viewers, so if I missed something, I welcome feedback.

Subj: Re:WWE II–SPOILER
Date: 96-05-25 01:21:34 EDT
From: Arance
Posted on: America Online

Will someone please try to remember…

During the scene in B^2 when Sinclair tells Delenn that he tried to tell them (warn them), but it will happen anyway, Delenn had not changed to the Minbari-Human hybrid yet, correct? I seem to remember that they showed her in the full Minbari make-up…yet in WWE2, she is shown during the same conversation as transformed. Am I wrong here? Or just a little glitch in the continuity?

The voice at the door during Delenn’s vision of the future is definately Sheridans wife….the one everyone thought dead….could this be the “one who is already dead”?

Man, I love this show! Thank you JMS…thank you.

Subj: Re:Flashback scenes in “WWEI
Date: 96-05-25 01:27:52 EDT
From: OGMA01
Posted on: America Online

Actually, quite a number of scenes from episode 2 were from Babylon^2, including several CG scenes. One of many things that impressed me was the fact that (and JMS has somehow managed to do this before) the original actor to portray the captain of B4 returned. I guess it must simply be such a pleasure to work on the show that the actors want to return (except for the woman who played Londo’s beloved and of course the original actor who played Draal.)

Subj: Re:WWE II–SPOILER
Date: 96-05-25 01:28:46 EDT
From: LoudonB
Posted on: America Online

Actually, if I recall correctly, they did not show Deleen’s face, only her arm. I do beleive that the cloth she was wearing was a bit more red than in WWE II.

LoudonB

Subj: Re:WWE, P-2, Question
Date: 96-05-25 03:34:31 EDT
From: JVibber
Posted on: America Online

Spoiler for WWE II

 

 

 

 

 
<< The door opens, behind Delenn you see the shadow of the person at the door >>
<< Maybe it’s Anne Sheridan come back >>

Hmmm. You mean Anne Sheridan is a SHADOW??? 😉
Subj: Re:WWE II–SPOILER
Date: 96-05-25 03:39:52 EDT
From: JVibber
Posted on: America Online

<< During the scene in B^2 when Sinclair tells Delenn that he tried to tell them (warn them), but it will happen anyway, Delenn had not changed to the Minbari-Human hybrid yet, correct? I seem to remember that they showed her in the full Minbari make-up…yet in WWE2, she is shown during the same conversation as transformed. Am I wrong here? Or just a little glitch in the continuity? >>

No glitch. In “Babylon Squared” you do not see anything but Delenn’s hand and forearm in the scene. The rest of her is off screen. You are correct, that as far as the audience was concerned, Delenn had not transformed — but the scene took place in a time AFTER Delenn’s transformation. To keep the impact of her change intact, JMS kept the future Delenn off camera.

Actually, one LITTLE glitch. In “Babylon Squared,” the sleeve of Delenn’s dress was red, while in “War Without End” it was green. Apparently, they could not match the clothing in “War Without End”, so they decided “the heck with it.”
Subj: Re:WWE, P-2, Question
Date: 96-05-25 10:28:05 EDT
From: Tedo
Posted on: America Online

<< The door opens, behind Delenn you see the shadow of the person at the door >>
<< Maybe it’s Anne Sheridan come back >>

<<Hmmm. You mean Anne Sheridan is a SHADOW??? ;)>>

My girlfriend has been on a kick for several weeks about Sheridan’s wife. There was something mentioned about a triangle and we thought Deleen, and the Sheridan’s would be it…but now we know the One are the Three thus killing that theory. But when that voice in the ‘shadows’ said hello…well…just makes you wonder where all that can go.
What a great show! I agree with others saying best Sci-Fi on TV ever….’course having Mr Ellison around was my first clue this was gonna be a good show.
Let’s all keep getting the word out and write your local stations!!!!!!!

Subj: Big time differences.
Date: 96-05-25 12:21:11 EDT
From: Yakko900
Posted on: America Online

Spoilers ahead

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Yes Delenn’s robe/dress is definitely different in b^2 than in WWE2. But that’s not all.

Stuff that happened in B^2:
-The captain of B4 said that Zathras just appeared in the conference room after a flash of light.

-Zathras said he gave his time stabilizer to The One and for some unknown reason he wasn’t jumping in time. Althought The One was.(this might have something to do with the type of alien Zathras is, who knows)

-Zathras referred to the The One as ‘him’. He specifically said “Zathras warned him, but no one listen to poor Zathras.” He also talked more about The One saying he would die for The One. Making suspect that there was a single The One to begin with. Therefore it would be fitting to call him The One.

 

Now that’s just the big stuff. There is some more but it is just as meaningless as the color of Delenn’s robe/dress.

Now I don’t mean too be critical, because this show is great. Besides this stuff I cant’ think of a single thing that I would question.

In fact this stuff really isn’t that big a deal. You just have to accept that JMS changed his mind about some things once he decided to replace Sinclair with Sheridan and since he does not have a great machine of his own he couldn’t exactly go back and change the B^2 episode to fit his new ideas.

Subj: Re: Metaphor for Zathros
Date: 96-05-25 12:31:18 EDT
From: WifeAgain
Posted on: America Online

LOL…..Great!

Subj: Big time differences. 2
Date: 96-05-25 12:36:44 EDT
From: Yakko900
Posted on: America Online

Spoilers ahead

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 
There’s one I forgot to mention.

In B^2 Zathras says that The One stopped the time taking to let the crew off.

After B^2 my friends and I thought that B4 was being taken into the future. I think this is the major reason. So after WWE part one my friends and I were a little confused until we went back and watched b^2.(yes i’m lucky enough to have a friend who has taped every episode).

In fact I would go out on a limb and say that B4 was going to the future to help in the upcoming shadow war, but then again JMS changed his mind. I think once he decided to have a new captain he decided to take B4 into the past so he could make Sinclair be Valen.

Subj: Re:WWE, P-2, Question
Date: 96-05-25 17:04:30 EDT
From: RNGRRIK
Posted on: America Online

Spoiler warning

 

 

Spoiler warning

 

 

Heard months ago that Melissa Gilbert, Boxleitner’s real-life wife would put in a guest shot on B-5 as Anna. Listen to the “hello” voice from Delenn’s future flash real carefully and you may realize that it’s Gilbert’s voice. We’ll see next season!

Subj: Re:Distress call & uniforms
Date: 96-05-25 19:43:17 EDT
From: BIL509
Posted on: America Online

I think that the reason Ivanova said Earth Force Station Babylon 5 and had on the new uniform was put in that way to make us talk about it and keep us guessing what it ment. After all, that is what we are doing, just a thought.

Bill

Subj: Re:WWE II–SPOILER
Date: 96-05-25 19:49:30 EDT
From: Arance
Posted on: America Online

Thanks to those who responded to my question regarding Delenn’s appearance (or partial appearance…) in B^2. I now wish I had kept my tapes of the early shows!

One item I wou;d like others to ponder…..

When the future, older, Delenn tells the captive Sheridan, “Do not go to Za’ha’doum”. Does this have anything to do with the possibility of his wife returning? Do she cause him to go there? What is that thing on Londo’s shoulder? If you got to Za’ha’doum, do you end up with one of these “puppet-masters”? Did anyone notice that thing on him when we are first introduced to the “old” Londo? (I did not)

Subj: Re:to jms
Date: 96-05-30 00:26:39 EDT
From: Badinov
Posted on: America Online

>>I think it came from Epsilon 3, didn’t it? So Sinclair takes it, becomes Valen, and Valen hands it down through the ages and eventually Delenn gets it.<<

Sort of but not exactly. There’s nothing to prevent Valen from asking either the Vorlons or some mad Minbari scientist to create a device that changes the genetic structure of the user. Naturally, Valen would know what the device’s spec’s would be. This device is then stored on E3 until it ends up in Delenn’s hands. Someone had to create it at some point.
Badinov

Subj: Re:WWE2, Where Did John Go?
Date: 96-05-30 02:30:31 EDT
From: CLCnTYLRTX
Posted on: America Online

<I thought at first Sheridan and Delenn were Sinclair’s parents. But if Delenn was his mother, wouldn’t that make him born of Minbari?>

No, because he was a hybrid born of mixed heritage. The machine merely revealed the Minbari nature in him. Thus making him a “Minbari, not born of Minbari”. I.E., A Minbari, not born from a Minbari heritage.

Subj: Re:The “Terrible Price”
Date: 96-05-30 02:38:31 EDT
From: CLCnTYLRTX
Posted on: America Online

A terrible price for Sheridan to have to pay would be to have to kill Ann (a Shadow possessed Ann like Morden).
Subj: “Already dead” speculation
Date: 96-05-30 10:36:22 EDT
From: Filops
Posted on: America Online

I’ve got it! (Maybe.) Everyone’s speculated about who “the one who is already dead” is. I want to add my $00.0175, plus some other corollary speculations.

**SPECULATION SPACE** in re. “the one who is already dead” and all:
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*What if* — “the one who is already dead,” whom Londo is not to kill, is Morden, who essentially died (as to his individuality) on Za’ha’dum? (Also, he was considered dead, along with all on the ship.)

*What if* — Londo, never one to do the right thing, ignores the prophetic warning and kills Morden when he learns that Morden had Adira killed?

As the prophecy warned, this would be a bad move. So…

*What if*, when Londo kills Morden, Morden’s Keeper attaches itself to Londo, thus furthering Londo’s journey into soul-ruin?

*What if* that is why Londo’s only remaining hope becomes to embrace what he fears most (G’kar’s attack), knowing that it will destroy him — though liberating him from his Keeper, and securing his “redemption” by facilitating Sheridan’s and Delenn’s escape, in the process?

*What if* that’s why it is necessary that G’kar die while killing Londo — so that the Keeper would have none to whom to re-attach itself when Londo dies?

Don’t you *love* this show? Gosh, we do!

Dan

Subj: summer episodes
Date: 96-05-30 12:06:30 EDT
From: MiniWabit2
Posted on: America Online

are they going to go back and show divided loyalties do you think? They were real close to it when they switched to new shows, and not they are going back and showing B5 secciding again. I have seen the show twice, and it is gettig a little old. but i have never seen DL.

Oh well

Tiff

Subj: Re:to jms
Date: 96-05-30 14:52:09 EDT
From: RNGRRIK
Posted on: America Online

“someone had to create it”—not necessarily. Read Harry Harrison’s The Technicolor Time Machine—the main character goes back in time to make a movie and winds up being handed the script by a future version of himself, who of course got it the same way. Perhaps the device is one of those arcane works of fate that had no beginning or end.

Subj: Re:The “Terrible Price”
Date: 96-05-30 14:53:06 EDT
From: RNGRRIK
Posted on: America Online

Good point! That fits the plot very well, and would explain Sheridan’s “loss of innocence”

Subj: Re:The “Terrible Price”
Date: 96-05-30 15:52:38 EDT
From: Daemar4267
Posted on: America Online

Since Kosh was always so cryptic, couldn’t ‘death’ refer to something other than a physical death? Perhaps it refers to something inside him dying when he is forced to kill his wife.

Subj: Re:Morden/Mordred & Vorlons
Date: 96-05-30 16:10:09 EDT
From: SYarmo8050
Posted on: America Online

Where did the vorlons come from?
Why, they have always been there;)

Subj: Re:Keepers
Date: 96-05-30 18:19:33 EDT
From: CRC2001
Posted on: America Online

I didn’t see it when it was asleep either.

Subj: Re:The “Terrible Price”
Date: 96-05-30 18:22:38 EDT
From: CRC2001
Posted on: America Online

I don’t know abbout sacrificing earth. I am not sure that even Sheridan could find it in his heart to do that. But it may be that he has already sacrificed Narn. Of then there would have had to have been a way to stop the destrction of (Ala Narn).

Subj: Re:”Already dead” speculatio
Date: 96-05-30 18:26:26 EDT
From: CRC2001
Posted on: America Online

I think that you have the right idea now that I think about it Dan. It makes sense, but I wonder how Morden is already dead. Is it because he is controlled by the Keeper?

Subj: Re:to jms
Date: 96-05-30 18:28:32 EDT
From: CRC2001
Posted on: America Online

I guess anything is possible, but I just don’t see how something could exist without it beeing created.

Subj: Re:wwe pt2
Date: 96-05-30 19:33:44 EDT
From: CWheater
Posted on: America Online

>>>>Here’s another one: How did it happen the FIRST time? You would have to assume that the humans still managed to build B5 (and B4, of course) and that they managed to conceive of stealing the station (assuming they went ahead and built B5 with B4 still functioning) and traveling back in time to defeat the Shadows back when the war started (1,000 years ago). But, the first time through, Valen does not exist, and all the participants would still have to be born and come together. (Now my head is really throbbing). <<<<

Which time was the FIRST time? When we start playing with the topology of time this way, things like order, precedence and succession, and cause and effect all become rather muddled for me. In truth, my very limited sense that I have any feeble understanding of the universe evaporates. I HATE THIS. It makes me anxious. So why do I think about nothing else?

ARGH!
Carolyn

 

Subj: Re:”Already dead” speculatio
Date: 96-05-30 21:23:30 EDT
From: Filops
Posted on: America Online

Thanks, CRC!

Well, I’d say Morden’s “dead” in that his personality and his humanity is gone, perhaps? Or perhaps in that he is “dead” in that he was supposed to be dead along with the rest of that lost expedition, and then just pops back up (as a Shadow agent)?

Dan

Subj: Re:”Already dead” speculatio
Date: 96-05-30 21:44:20 EDT
From: CPamir
Posted on: America Online

Sounds good to me.

Subj: Re:”Already dead” speculatio
Date: 96-05-30 21:54:47 EDT
From: Delennn
Posted on: America Online

If you want to speculate about Morden being the one who is already dead, then couldn’t Anna also fit into that category, IF she is the one to show up on B5 and IF she is posessed by the Shadows.

Subj: altered time
Date: 96-05-30 23:57:01 EDT
From: CAMButcher
Posted on: America Online

Mythophile said << Pity she forgot to put her hand on his shoulder this time around, hm? ;)>>

Yup, we are in a different time stream from the original B^2. There are too many little differences for all of them to be continuity errors. Delenn’s sleeves area different shade of red, in a slightly different style. Sheridan isn’t seated, he is standing. Delenn doesn’t put her hand on his shoulder. Zathras is caught in a cargo bay, not zapped into a conference room. The figure phasing in and out is shorter. There may be a few more we haven’t caught.

The Great Maker did say the future isn’t a done deal. Choice is a major theme in the show. All of the characters have had choices to make, and these have subtly altered the future. I like it. :-)

cam

 

Subj: Snowglobe
Date: 96-05-30 23:57:42 EDT
From: CAMButcher
Posted on: America Online

I seem to remember that Sheridan’s snowglobe was a gift from his father, and associated with happy memories. It had something to do with a vacation, with Sheridan’s facination with a lighthouse. I don’t think he ever got to go to the lighthouse, just dream of it.

….or am I suffering from False Memory Syndrome? 8-D My tape archive doesn’t start until A Race Through Dark Places; could someone please check Revelations (Sheridan’s sister visits) to see if it is in that ep? I don’t think he told it then, but I can’t recall the circumstances of the conversation. (maybe Delenn, in the Zen garden??)
cam
Subj: time loop
Date: 96-05-30 23:58:33 EDT
From: CAMButcher
Posted on: America Online

A time loop isn’t necessarily a paradox. It depends on how you define the system. Let’s say you decide to make a mobius strip out of paper. You take a normal, 2 sided sheet of paper, cut a strip out of it with scissors, fold the strip back on itself, add a twist, then secure the ends together with tape. The loop is now a closed system, and an imaginary bug on the loop would skitter around it from now until it passed Beyond The Veil without escaping. The presence of the loop on your desk doesn’t effect the rest of the papers.

Why couldn’t someone with the right scissors make a mobius loop out of time? Perhaps the Great Machine of E3 does the cutting, twisting and taping. There * is* a beginning, when the loop is created, where the elements in the loop are first introduced. There is a reality outside of the loop which is not connected to what is happening in the loop. There may be an ending, if something happens to break the loop.

OTOH, maybe Minbari for “Groundhog Day” is “Valen.” :-) (LOL, Badinov)
cam

 

Subj: Re:Epsilon 3
Date: 96-05-31 00:11:18 EDT
From: DaveShufon
Posted on: America Online

<<I’m going strictly by memory here, but wasn’t the person who was in the Great Machine before
Draal–back in “A Voice In The Wilderness”–a member of the race that created it?>>

No, Varn’s people were only caretakers for the machine. They weren’t the ones who built it.

Subj: Re:to jms
Date: 96-05-31 00:12:11 EDT
From: DaveShufon
Posted on: America Online

<<Re: the “Chysalis machine” – is this interchangable with or powered from or unrelated to the Triluminary devices? Are we supposed to assume that THEY came from E3? I gathered that there were supposed to be three of them (in current time anyway, or last month anyway) and that Delenn had one.>>

The Triluminary is the key part of this device. And yes, it did come up from Epsilon 3 with Zathras. I read somewhere that JMS said that they were in a box with triangle symbols on it that Zathras was bringing in. There was another scene where the box was shown that ended up getting cut.

Subj: Re:to jms
Date: 96-05-31 00:15:06 EDT
From: DaveShufon
Posted on: America Online

<<Sort of but not exactly. There’s nothing to prevent Valen from asking either the Vorlons or some mad Minbari scientist to create a device that changes the genetic structure of the user. Naturally, Valen would know what the device’s spec’s would be. This device is then stored on E3 until it ends up in Delenn’s hands. Someone had to create it at some point.>>

I believe I read somewhere that JMS said that the Triluminaries were built by the same people who built the Great Machine. He definitely said that Zathras brought them up with him for Sinclair and that these are the Triluminaries that the Grey Council “found” 1000 years ago. Delenn still has the one she used.

Subj: Re:to jms
Date: 96-05-31 13:23:34 EDT
From: RNGRRIK
Posted on: America Online

Here’s an oddball idea—maybe Sinclair/Valen was responsible for the creation of the Great Machine on Epsilon3.

Subj: tension
Date: 96-05-31 14:56:22 EDT
From: BARRIEJ
Posted on: America Online

I don’t know about you guys in this board topic, but those of us who gather in the Delenn/sheridan topic have been feeling the tension and dread rising for months and it doesn’t let up with wwoe#2.

I don’t know what JMS is up to, but I’m so worried I’m seriously thinking of checking out. like bury my head in the sand, go cold turkey. die. whatever. I can’t stand this.

Subj: If I Died Today
Date: 96-05-31 14:58:48 EDT
From: BARRIEJ
Posted on: America Online

JMS,

If I had to die today, the ONE thing I would want to take with me would be my B5 epsiode tapes! I’m sure I could get them through “customs.”

thank you for the best I’ve ever seen anywhere, anytime, anyplace. But please don’t torture me anymore, I’m dreading the last few epsidoes and right now, I think I’d rather be dead than watch them.

If I volunteered to take Delenn and Sheridan’s karma, would you spare them? how about that!

Subj: Confessions & L.
Date: 96-05-31 15:00:09 EDT
From: BARRIEJ
Posted on: America Online

although this is not about wwoe#2 or severed dreams or even ceremonis which comes next week, it still feels fitting for this spot

A reflection. One of the things I love about Delenn is that she often strikes me as finding being human a wondrous experience. Even with her Minbari sense of destiny and perhaps determinination to fulfill prophecy, she has opened herself up to being human and all it implies. When was the last time we though falling in love was magical? Usually it gets sandwiched into trips to the market, paying bills, finding sitters for kids (for single parents), and although we might be happy, is it wondrous? When she touched his face in “Confessions” she seemed as if enchanted with the experience (“so that’s what a man’s face feels like, hm, I guess he “shaves”).

That’s what I like about what JMS has done so far with this relationship, he brings out the wonder of falling in love, and this is the one thing that keeps bringing me back to the show.

Barrie

Subj: Re:”Already dead” speculatio
Date: 96-05-31 17:11:32 EDT
From: CRC2001
Posted on: America Online

Yea, I wonder if he is dead because the Shadows had to kill him before putting the keeper in him, so he might be clinically dead, but his organs were (for lack of a better word) reincarnated by the Keeper. that might be why they sleep when alchohal is consumed, after all, look what it does to us.

Subj: Re:”Already dead” speculatio
Date: 96-05-31 17:12:49 EDT
From: CRC2001
Posted on: America Online

Maybe, that would also fit with anything we said in other messages, but it could be both.

Subj: Time Loop?
Date: 96-05-31 17:18:43 EDT
From: CRC2001
Posted on: America Online

I don’t even like the idea of time travel do to so many complications. But if it were a loop, wouldn’t be kind of hard to jump from past, present, future. Or is loop just a way of saying that time is continuous, and it is possible to go back to a different spot. But then if it were physically a loop, then you could go backward in time and end up in the future? Do I have the idea here, or am I going nuts?

Subj: Re:Time Travel Complications
Date: 96-05-31 21:13:02 EDT
From: VSeidel220
Posted on: America Online

Regarding LoudenB’s reference to Einstein’s work, there is a book that was published a few years
ago called The ABC’s of Relativity that is aimed more at laymen than the other, howver it does
still have to explain some things mathematically. If you accept the theory that time is a dimension like the others, then it must exist simultaneously infinitely. Again, it is our perception
that makes it seem linear. Just my two cents.
Victoria S.

Subj: Re:WWE2, Where Did John Go?
Date: 96-05-31 21:24:47 EDT
From: VSeidel220
Posted on: America Online

I was wondering where he went that las time he disappeared, too. But if you noticed, when Susan
says “They’ve got Zathras”.. Delenn looks worried and then goes back to where John has reappeared before. Sinclair had said that if Zathras couldn’t fix the time stabilizer they might lose
John. Then when John reappears Delenn (Minbari are much stronger than humans) takes him
out of the suit and gets into it to protect him, hoping, I would imagine, that Zathras would be able
to come through.
Victoria S.

Subj: Re:wwe pt2
Date: 96-05-31 21:33:42 EDT
From: VSeidel220
Posted on: America Online

I thought that Vir did appear a little older, but my first thought was that he knew they were dead
when he went in. Does that mean that Vir has a “keeper” attached to him also? Londo did say
that “we all have our keepers”…by all, did he mean all of the Centauri leaders? Thoughts to
ponder for next season.

Victoria S.

Subj: Re:Finely Crafted Series
Date: 96-06-01 08:04:57 EDT
From: ReddGator
Posted on: America Online

Can anyone get, or make, an electronic version of the article. Most of us will never see a copy of the magazine.

Thanks.

Subj: Re:wwe pt2
Date: 96-06-01 09:46:02 EDT
From: LLarson10
Posted on: America Online

JMS has mentioned somewhere that Vir does not have a keeper attached. I think the scene where Vir entered to see Londo and G’Kar dead shows us a Vir who knows the mantle of Centauri
leadership just fell onto his shoulders.

Subj: Re:”Already dead” speculatio
Date: 96-06-01 10:55:57 EDT
From: Filops
Posted on: America Online

Hi, Delennnnnnnnnnnnnnnn! (c;

<<If you want to speculate about Morden being the one who is already dead, then couldnt Anna also fit into that category, IF she is the one to show up on B5 and IF she is posessed by the Shadows.>> Yep, that would work too.

1. In favor of Morden over Anna, given our present state of knowledge: we don’t know any reason why Londo would be motivated to kill Anna. By contrast, we *do* know why he’d want to kill Morden — for the murder of Adira.

2. However in fairness, in favor of Anna is the phrasing: if memory serves me right, the phrasing was, “Do not kill THE ONE who is dead.” Not “Do not kill HIM who is dead.” As if to couch the gender of the person. (Ooooh, that jms!)

Dannnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn (c;

Subj: Re:wwe pt2
Date: 96-06-01 11:44:27 EDT
From: CRC2001
Posted on: America Online

I think he does have a keeper because he has kind of the same look on his face that Morden always had.

Subj: Re:”Already dead” speculatio
Date: 96-06-02 01:24:05 EDT
From: RNGRRIK
Posted on: America Online

“The One” in that statement would indicate to me it’s talking about Sheridan—The One, and the only one of the three who are The One that could fit the category, since Sinclair died 900 years ago and Delenn was still alive at the time the decision had to be made. Face it—Sheridan is fated to die on Zahadum.

Subj: Re:”Already dead” speculatio
Date: 96-06-02 05:40:08 EDT
From: Archer C1
Posted on: America Online

<Face it—Sheridan is fated to die on Zahadum.>

Since he goes to Zha’ha’dum this year, how come he’s still around in 17 years and Delenn is not surprised to see him? Yet we know from Delenn warning, that the future Sheridan went to Zha’ha’dum. Actually, Kosh’s warning is not exactly fearless. “If you go to Zha’ha’dum, you will die.” So what? Sheridan will die someday no matter what he does. Kosh’s warning does not say he will buy the spoo ranch ON Zha’ha’dum. My guess is that if he does not go to Zha’ha’dum, Sheridan will achieve some form of immortality. How’s that for going out on a limb?

Also, practically speaking, JMS is not going to recast the lead role AGAIN.

Subj: TIME TRAVEL
Date: 96-06-02 12:33:11 EDT
From: METROAPE
Posted on: America Online

Why could he go 17 years in furture come back to his normal time conceive a son with delenn tell delenn about his travels fight the shadows go to Za-ha doom and be killed? This would mean he went to the future but died in the past. That maybe why delenn had a look on her face like thought he had been gone a very long time . Delenn warned him of Za-ha doom so that he may live on!

Subj: fan club????????????????????
Date: 96-06-02 12:38:17 EDT
From: METROAPE
Posted on: America Online

I Joined the club I’ve for weeeek’s and no mail! B-5 WERE ARE YOU?

Subj: Severed Dreams/Ivanova
Date: 96-06-02 13:05:30 EDT
From: YostSilk
Posted on: America Online

I just watched SD and something at the end really bothered me and I’m hoping I’m just reading too much into it. As the ep ends the camera focuses in on the poster regarding traitors, Ivanova is still in the shot, alone. Could this mean something?

Subj: Re:Time Travel Complications
Date: 96-06-02 14:48:03 EDT
From: JVibber
Posted on: America Online

There was a discussion about “free will” on one of the folders a few weeks back. The episodes WWE I and II with their time loop got me to thinking on this topic a bit. The events in the loop occur mostly because people CHOOSE to make them happen. Sinclair chooses to go back in time because the evidence (such as his letter to himself) says he DID. The crew of the White Star goes back to rescue B4 from the Shadows’ bomb because of a historical Great Machine video tape that shows that they DID. (Wasn’t it nice of the Shadows to wait until the station was FINISHED before they tried to blow it up? Certainly they must have recognized it by its shape long before all the gun, computers, and life support were put in place!)

And yet,… And yet, we are shown an alternate future 8 days from “now” in which B5 is attacked by a Shadow force that is larger than it would be if Babylon 4 had not been succesfully sent back in time. From little hints I’ve heard, the next episode will show B5 being attacked by Shadows, with the difference that they will arrive a little later and in fewer numbers, so (presumably) the station will NOT get destroyed.

At any time, the characters are completely free to choose NOT to follow the things history tells them to do. But what would happen if they do something different? If Sinclair chose not to go back in time, and Marcus had gone, would we STILL have had a Valen? Would things be slightly different in detail, but the overall “shape” of history remain unchanged? If Sinclair chose not to go back in time, would some “accident” have pinned him to the floor at the last minute, forcing him to go anyway?

I remember reading a very nice story about a man who kept trying to prevent his own death by murder at the hands of his enraged wife. This worked out because he was recruited by “time police” who grab somebody from the time stream just before death and substitute a clone so a body will be found, but now they have a “recruit” who has no real choice but to join them. He goes back in time and removes the gun his wife shoots him with — but she finds a kitchen knife and stabs him. This goes on and on, with him removing more and more of the murder weapons and something else causing his death. Eventually, it looks like he has succeeded. His wife leaves in a rage, no murder. He watches himself wander over to the apartment window, and a micrometeorite smashes through and neatly drills him through the head. At that point, the guy gives up — if the universe adjusts itself that thoroughly and “wants” him dead that much, there’s really nothing he can do to change it.

So, how “flexible” is the universe in B5? Will we ever know?
Subj: Re:”Already dead” speculatio
Date: 96-06-02 23:40:15 EDT
From: SHERzipp
Posted on: America Online

Maybe Kosh was not talking about a corporeal death. Perhaps what he meant was what Delenn was alluding to in WWE2, that something in John died on Za’ha’doom — his innocence, something of his humanity. You know it’s going to come down to what happens to Anna later this season.

Sher

Subj: Re:Big time differences. 2
Date: 96-06-03 01:40:49 EDT
From: DaveAtCWRU
Posted on: America Online

<<<
In fact I would go out on a limb and say that B4 was going to the future to help in the upcoming shadow war, but then again JMS changed his mind. I think once he decided to have a new captain he decided to take B4 into the past so he could make Sinclair be Valen.>>>

I doubt that. The whole Valen prophisies the future thread has been with us since the first season. I do not mean to say that Delenn quoted Valen’s prophisies in the first season, merely that her and the Mimbari’s actions subtly confirmed that Mimbari had knowledge of the future. So we knew that someone had knowledge of future events. JMS promised only one time travel during the length of the show, so this would have to have been planned from the beginning.

As to who was supposed to go back, I think that was a later decision.
Subj: Re:Time Travel Complications
Date: 96-06-03 14:41:02 EDT
From: CAMButcher
Posted on: America Online

JVibber asks some very interesting questions: <<The events in the loop occur mostly because people CHOOSE to make them happen. ……But what would happen if they do something different? If Sinclair chose not to go back in time, and Marcus had gone, would we STILL have had a Valen? Would things be slightly different in detail, but the overall “shape” of history remain unchanged? If Sinclair chose not to go back in time, would some “accident” have pinned him to the floor at the last minute, forcing him to go anyway?>>

We know that a character’s Choice in minor matters works, because the time stream in WWE is different from the flashbacks in B^2. There are too many small differences between the two for them to be continuity errors. Free will in larger matters is interesting. Maybe, as Delenn says, “The universe knows what it is doing.”

Remember Jame’s Burke’s “Connections” science series? It showed how great inventions were made, each building on the foundation of other discoveries. It almost seemed some inventions were inevitable, like the steam engine, because of the general trend of thought and discovery at the time. Some events in time may be unavoidable.

Does this work for people? Would some other British politician have had his finest hour if Churchill didn’t rise to the occasion? I don’t think so, tho Britain might have rallied and survived the war without him. Some events are driven by personality. Sinclair went back in time ready to be Valen. He would become worthy of worship by throwing himself into the role, giving the Minbari hope for the future. Had Marcus gone back, the Minbari might have won using B4 as a base, but there would have been no Valen, no long term strengthening of Minbari society.

A reluctant Sinclair could really alter the future. If he just said No, but was pinned in B4 during the time shift, he would be a bitter leader. He might do too little, too late, allowing the Shadows to go underground with more of their strength intact. Even if he snapped out of it ,he might have been a great war leader, but not very inspirational. Respect and awe for Valen changed their entire society. I can’t see the Minbari elevating a grouchy, bitter person to godhood.

If we are lucky, we may see a book about this…….:-)

Carol
Subj: Re:”Already dead” speculatio
Date: 96-06-03 17:52:18 EDT
From: CRC2001
Posted on: America Online

Well now I guess I would say it comes down to Sheridan, If he loses a part of himself, his innocence, maybe he becomes a Shadow guy. So maybe Kosh was supposed to keep him from that fate. But KOsh is dead.

Subj: WWE, Pt 2
Date: 96-06-04 00:32:52 EDT
From: BricksGirl
Posted on: America Online

HELP!!!!! My VCR died with 15 minutes left in the show! I’m dying to know what happened!!! Everything and anything would be greatly appreciated.

Subj: Re:”Already dead” speculatio
Date: 96-06-04 01:13:51 EDT
From: Banya
Posted on: America Online

Perhaps Delenn’s warning sheridan not to go to Zha’ha’dum had more to do with his *emotional* well-being than physical. If he goes there, he will surely discover things about Anna that will hurt him.

Subj: Re:”Already dead” speculatio
Date: 96-06-04 15:44:29 EDT
From: CRC2001
Posted on: America Online

Do we actually KNOW that Anne is a Shadow agent. I can’t remember for sure. But that would make perfect sense. I just want to see some hot fire fights in the near future.

Subj: Re:”Already dead” speculatio
Date: 96-06-04 16:04:54 EDT
From: BKnight255
Posted on: America Online

One thing to remember…

Sheridan is fully prepared to die if that’s what it takes to accomplish his objective. He said as much to Kosh.

Whatever is going to happen on Z’ha’dum, though, is probably going to be a lot worse.

I agree with the speculation that it’s intimately mixed in with the question of Anna Sheridan, and that somehow she’s going to be at the crux of this. Remember, he was broken up for a long time (ending with “Revelations”) about never having had the chance to say goodbye to her the last time … and remember, when he saw a glimmer of hope that she might be alive, he was ready to do anything … ANYTHING … if it would save her, or let him know that she was at peace. If you recall, in “In the Shadow of Z’ha’dum”, Delenn and Kosh intervened practically at the last to keep him from forcing the Shadows’ hand.

And a very healthy part of Sheridan’s zeal in the Shadow War is probably blood-lust, a desire for vengeance against those who took the great love of his life from him.

He’d sacrifice himself to bring the Shadows down.

He’d sacrifice everything to save Anna.

And if he found out she was alive … and had to either let her die … or kill her himself … it would be far, far worse than dying himself. Those of you who know what that feeling is, know that you’d rather tear your own guts out than let harm come to the one you love.

It’s my suspicion that he’s going to be forced to make that terrible choice … and that a part of him will die as a result…

Subj: Re:”Already dead” speculatio
Date: 96-06-04 16:37:36 EDT
From: LLarson10
Posted on: America Online

Very interesting take on the situation. Pretty much how I feel about it. Also brings into play Sheridan’s “Coventry” scenario but at a much more personal level.. Makes me want to close my eyes or hide under the covers…someone tell when it’s safe to look or come out of hiding!

Subj: Re:”Already dead” speculation
Date: 96-06-04 19:45:44 EDT
From: PigDog13
Posted on: America Online

Ah, but death has many meanings and conotations. None of you should be so hasty to jump to conclusions.
John Copeland
Producer – Babylon 5

Subj: Re:”Already dead” speculatio
Date: 96-06-04 22:01:52 EDT
From: Jennif4183
Posted on: America Online

If there is any thing I’ve LEARN……never jump to any conclusions with this show…never, never, never…….

Jennifer

Subj: Re:”Already dead” speculatio
Date: 96-06-04 22:20:17 EDT
From: ReddGator
Posted on: America Online

John, if this is really you, then forgive us for our speculations. My preference would be for you to post on the B5 Ratings board and tell us what happened with B5 ratings during the last few weeks, as well as the latest on the B5 renewal. Seems to me that someone in a position of responsibility would be interested in passing this type of information along.

Sincerely,

ReddGator

Subj: Re:Spoiler WWE One/Speculati
Date: 96-06-05 00:31:25 EDT
From: Duderator
Posted on: America Online

jms has stated that the B5 vessel is still the property of Earth alliance. nuff said.

Subj: Re:Speculation-Londo Prophec
Date: 96-06-05 00:37:16 EDT
From: Duderator
Posted on: America Online

WWE,pt2 spoiler! Stop if you don’t want to ruin it for you…..
,
.
.,
m
m
n
n
n
The three… Sinclair (the one that WAS), Delenn (the one that IS) and Sheridan (the one that
WILL BE). Note that Sinclair has used the Triluminary device to become Valen, a “Minbari not
born of Minbar). Note that Delenn has used this device as “balance” and become more human.
There is one device left. One must die to be reborn. Think about it….

Subj: Re: Summer episodes
Date: 96-06-05 00:42:05 EDT
From: Duderator
Posted on: America Online

The season should ramp up again in September when (if) the show is renewed. the first ep
should be “Walk-about”, I believe…

Subj: Re:WWE II–SPOILER
Date: 96-06-05 00:48:46 EDT
From: Duderator
Posted on: America Online

To muddle the waters further, suspend your previous beliefs for one moment about who the
person was in the doorway. What if… that person who caused Delenn to drop the snow
globe is none other than… Ivanova!

Subj: Re:Time Loop?
Date: 96-06-05 01:14:08 EDT
From: Duderator
Posted on: America Online

Time travel has always been frought with paradox and juxtiposition (sp). JMS has freely
admitted this 2-part ep was the hardest thing he has ever done and really stretched his
talents as an author. It is very possible that some theories and conjecture presented here
are viable and that JMS, being just a human, couldn’t tie every string together.

Subj: Re:”Already dead” speculatio
Date: 96-06-05 01:17:38 EDT
From: Duderator
Posted on: America Online

Jms has stated that ALL characters have been devised with escapes in case something
terrible happens to the actor or the actor leaves (like Talia and the general). If Bruce leaves
for whatever reason, jms has a backup plan….

Subj: Re:WWE II–SPOILER
Date: 96-06-05 01:22:11 EDT
From: RNGRRIK
Posted on: America Online

Why Ivonova? The only person she’s shown a romantic inclination toward was Talia.

Subj: Re:”Already dead” speculatio
Date: 96-06-05 02:11:44 EDT
From: JVibber
Posted on: America Online

<< Ah, but death has many meanings and conotations. None of you should be so hasty to jump to conclusions. — John Copeland >>

Ooooh! This is looking better and better!

I can’t help thinking that there’s more to becoming a Shadow minion (or at least a Shadow “dupe”) than caving in to an offer you can’t refuse — or even being physically killed and resurrected. My expectation regarding Sheridan’s trip to Z’Ha’Dum (isn’t it inevitable?) is that (1) he’ll see something that made the “entechment” of Bester’s lover look like a lover’s caress, and (2) there’s a very good chance that it will be done to HIM. If Sheridan can somehow come back from THAT, you can be sure he’ll no longer be “Smiling John.”
Subj: Re:”Already dead” speculatio
Date: 96-06-05 10:11:37 EDT
From: AmberH
Posted on: America Online

Also, we still don’t know what the Shadows motivations really are. We don’t know what promises were made or what kind of enticement given to “seduce” people over to their side. No one has had the chance to ask Morden why he is doing what he’s doing. For all we know, the shadows saved him, healed him and then convinced him that their side of the story was the correct one. Until we find out what’s going on with the Shadows adn why they’re doing what they’re doing, things are very much up in the air.

Subj: Re:”Already dead” speculatio
Date: 96-06-05 10:46:10 EDT
From: Filops
Posted on: America Online

Pigdog’s post means that one of us hit it on the head, and he’s trying to detour us. (Was it me?)

— OR —

Pigdog’s post means that we’re all barking up the wrong trees, and he’s trying to save us from ourselves. (Including me!)

I love this show!

Dan

Subj: Re:”Already dead” speculatio
Date: 96-06-05 11:54:37 EDT
From: LLarson10
Posted on: America Online

Thanks, John, for the reply. Can’t say it helps me feel any better..! =) What this Long Wait is doing to me, at any rate, is making me not only jump to conclusions but Just Plain Flatout JUMPY!

Subj: Re:”Already dead” speculatio
Date: 96-06-05 11:58:38 EDT
From: Miles1005
Posted on: America Online

>>Ah, but death has many meanings and conotations. None of you should be so hasty to jump to conclusions.
John Copeland
Producer – Babylon 5<<

Spoken like a true Vorlon.
Jim

Subj: Re:”Already dead” speculatio
Date: 96-06-05 12:51:07 EDT
From: CRC2001
Posted on: America Online

I could agree. Delenn points out his loss of innocence. Probably because he has to kill the Shadows and his only love. Then he probably seeks the total destruction of the Shadows for revenge. Once he thinks it is accomplished he decides to (disapear) into the Abyss (whatever that may be) and maybe never returns to finish the Shadows. Then of course Centauri lives on with Londo. Unless the Vorlons have some ideas of their own, without the Shadows who could stop them. Which is why I feel that those keepers are Vorlon weapons. Just a thought though.

Subj: Re:Speculation-Londo Prophec
Date: 96-06-05 12:56:30 EDT
From: CRC2001
Posted on: America Online

So Sinclair is the one who did die to be reborn, Delenn is the one who has just been reborn. Spoiler……………….

 

 

 
Sheridan was supposed to go to Za,ha,dum to die, and Kosh was supposed to bring him back safely to be reborn on the side of good. Thus the one who will be. But now what with Kosh dead? Does Anna save him, maybe she was rescued by Vorlons after the Shadow’s attack, simply because the Vorlons knew if Kosh died there would have to be a replacement?

Subj: Re:WWE II–SPOILER
Date: 96-06-05 12:58:05 EDT
From: CRC2001
Posted on: America Online

Na, to high a voice. Ivanova has a deeper voice than that. I think, hey maybe your right, but would that make sense?

Subj: Re:”Already dead” speculatio
Date: 96-06-05 13:01:33 EDT
From: CRC2001
Posted on: America Online

Aha, so the Big man shows himself. YOU RULE JMS, if that was even you, hard to tell when your looking at a computer screen. But for some reason that just sounds like something JMS would say.

Subj: Re: Ratings and other musings
Date: 96-06-05 15:20:26 EDT
From: PigDog13
Posted on: America Online

ReddGator:
Of course I can post stuff in the ratings folder, but I also enjoy driving folks to abstraction in other folders as well.
Regards,
John Copeland
Producer – Babylon 5

Subj: Re:”Already dead” speculation
Date: 96-06-05 15:22:41 EDT
From: PigDog13
Posted on: America Online

Aw, you all are just burning up the grey cells about this. And most of you are barking up the wrong tree. hehehehehehehe
John Copeland
Producer – Babylon 5

Subj: Re:Ivanova a traitor?!
Date: 96-06-05 17:23:43 EDT
From: SarahB6201
Posted on: America Online

Earlier somebody asked if the fact that, at the end of “Severed Dreams”, the fact that Ivanova standing alone in front of a poster that reads “Traitors cannot hide” means anything. I think JMS addressed this in another folder. According to him, no, it doesn’t mean anything; I think he used it as an example of clue-crazed fans reading meaning into EVERYTHING, whether there was intended meaning or not. He talks about in in the “Ask JMS” folder.
So Ivanova is cool…I THINK…

Subj: Re:WWE2, To ARCHER
Date: 96-06-05 18:42:05 EDT
From: Highway927
Posted on: America Online

I am curious. I seem to remember Delenn saying something to the effect that the Chryalis machine would only work with those of Minbari blood. How did Sinclair use it?

Subj: Re:WWE II–SPOILER
Date: 96-06-06 01:37:44 EDT
From: DEWainio
Posted on: America Online

Speaking of Delenn’s snowball visitor and John going to Z-Doom

<<And if he found out she >>(his wife)<< was alive … and had to either let her die … or kill her himself … it would be far, far worse than dying himself. >>

So what if she’s not dead, not evil, and he doesn’t need to kill her but rather rescue her? Now he’s got two lovers. Or maybe the Vorlons are holding on to his wife as someone suggested as a break on Sheridan if he gets out of hand on his legend killing tour. There are many possibilities…

Subj: Re:”Already dead” speculatio
Date: 96-06-06 14:40:27 EDT
From: CRC2001
Posted on: America Online

Sorry, Pig Dog. Say, Uhm, are you just fooling with us?

Subj: Re:”Already dead” speculatio
Date: 96-06-06 14:42:47 EDT
From: CRC2001
Posted on: America Online

You have a good sense of humor as well as a great talent for production huh Mr. Copeland?

Subj: Re:Ivanova a traitor?!
Date: 96-06-06 14:44:02 EDT
From: CRC2001
Posted on: America Online

I just thought that it was a night watch poster and it was being showed because it was ripped in half, or I thought it was.

Subj: Re: Summer episodes
Date: 96-06-06 14:49:36 EDT
From: RabLib
Posted on: America Online

The last 5 episodes of the season are supposedly going to air in September, their titles are:
Walkabout; Grey 17 is Missing; And the Rock Cried Out, No Hiding Place; Shadow Dancing
I have also heard rumor that the last episode – the jms won’t release the name of becuase it is supposed to be a spoiler in itself – is titled “Za’ha’dum” (sp?).
—Tirtzah (who can’t wait for the new episodes)

Subj: Re:”Already dead” speculatio
Date: 96-06-06 15:08:48 EDT
From: RabLib
Posted on: America Online

<<Delenn points out his loss of innocence. Probably because he has to kill the Shadows and his only love.>>
If the developing relationship between Delenn and Sheridan is not love, or rather if John isn’t in love with Delenn, I’ll eat my television.
No it’s quite clear that they are in love, so at leaste he will have someone to live for, someone to help him get through everything. I’m not saying it won’t effect him deaply, but I don’t think it will destroy him.

One other thing though, I was thinking of what else death might mean and remembered that with Tarot cards the Death card doesn’t nessassarily mean the person will die, but instead symbolizes (great) change.
Just a bone to chew on ,
Tirtzah

Subj: Re:”Already dead” speculation
Date: 96-06-06 20:37:31 EDT
From: PigDog13
Posted on: America Online

CRC2001:
I’m not fooling with you, maybe teasing a little, cuz I know what’s going to happen. And you are right about the Night Watch Poster — it is ripped as if someone has expressed their feelings about the NW.
John Copeland
Producer – Babylon 5

Subj: Re: Summer episodes
Date: 96-06-06 21:57:32 EDT
From: Highway927
Posted on: America Online

>>> Walkabout; Grey 17 is Missing; And the Rock Cried Out, No Hiding Place; Shadow Dancing>>>
Any ideas what these episodes are about? The Luker’s Guide is down!

Subj: Re: Summer episodes
Date: 96-06-07 01:48:48 EDT
From: AmberH
Posted on: America Online

Highway, Walkabout is about Dr. Franklin and about Lyta, Grey 17 is Missing is about Garibaldi and Minbari (if anyone saw the clip on Mira Furlan on the SF Buzz the other week, they had lots of Minbari in this one). The others are all secrets. And if anyone cares, JMS has now stated that (renewal permitting), the first episode of Season 4 is to be called “Hour of the Wolf”.

Subj: Sheridan’s Fate
Date: 96-06-07 02:37:50 EDT
From: MeMeTwo
Posted on: America Online

You can see it coming, guys. The biggest influence on JMS is not King Arthur, not Lord of the Rings, not Gilgamesh or Childhood’s End. The key to where this season–and Sheridan–are going is–
SPOILER SPACE

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Twin Peaks

 

 

Subj: Re:Sheridan’s Fate
Date: 96-06-07 04:47:17 EDT
From: Archer C1
Posted on: America Online

Does that mean the last shot of Babylon 5 will be Sheridan bashing his head against a mirror, giggling like a maniac?

Subj: Re:”Already dead” speculatio
Date: 96-06-07 10:41:01 EDT
From: Filops
Posted on: America Online

“*Mostly* barking up the wrong tree” — that means I’m right! I’m right! Yahhh-hahahaha!

::Filops Victory Dance:: (– not a pretty sight)

Dan

Subj: Re:”Already dead” speculatio
Date: 96-06-07 11:43:31 EDT
From: CRC2001
Posted on: America Online

Well I think that sooner or later JMS is going to shock the heck out of us all.

Subj: Re:”Already dead” speculatio
Date: 96-06-07 11:45:23 EDT
From: CRC2001
Posted on: America Online

Thanks Mr. Copeland, I’ve been wandering about that poster for awhile. When B5 declred independance Sheridan and Sinclair said something about there being problems with sabotage, will that be a key to a future episode?

Subj: Re: Summer episodes
Date: 96-06-07 11:46:32 EDT
From: CRC2001
Posted on: America Online

Cool, I love Wolves, hope that will be good, and they better renew this show!

Subj: Re:Sheridan’s Fate
Date: 96-06-07 11:47:37 EDT
From: CRC2001
Posted on: America Online

Twin Peaks, never saw that show. IT was a bunch of vampires wasn’t it. Oh boy, I see the connection there.

Subj: Re:”Already dead” speculatio
Date: 96-06-07 11:49:17 EDT
From: CRC2001
Posted on: America Online

Wait a minute, maybe somebody else is right pal, maybe me,
CRC victory dance “definately a pretty site, if you like that sort of thing”
Subj: Re:Sheridan’s Fate
Date: 96-06-07 13:24:43 EDT
From: Archer C1
Posted on: America Online

<Twin Peaks, never saw that show. IT was a bunch of vampires wasn’t it. Oh boy, I see the connection there.>

Not quite, but don’t ask me to explain what it actually WAS…

Just thinking though: Black Lodge = Zha’ha’dum? Nah!

Subj: Re: Summer episodes
Date: 96-06-07 20:50:06 EDT
From: PigDog13
Posted on: America Online

Highway927:
You ask: Walkabout; Grey 17 is Missing; And the Rock Cried Out, No Hiding Place; Shadow Dancing —
Any ideas what these episodes are about?
Yes.
John Copeland
Producer – Babylon 5

Subj: Re: Sabotage
Date: 96-06-07 20:56:16 EDT
From: PigDog13
Posted on: America Online

You saw the results of left over Night Watch in ep 311 – “Ceremonies of Light and Darkness.” However earth still has to be dealt with at some point.
John Copeland

Subj: Re: Renewal
Date: 96-06-07 21:10:21 EDT
From: PigDog13
Posted on: America Online

Well gang today we got the official confirmation of our pick up for the fourth season of “Babylon 5.” So everyone can relax.
Whoopee!
John Copeland
Producer – Babylon 5

Subj: Re:”Already dead” speculatio
Date: 96-06-07 23:11:50 EDT
From: Jennif4183
Posted on: America Online

< Ah, but death has many meanings and conotations. None of you should be so hasty to jump to conclusions. — John Copeland >>

A friend reminded me that it also could be exile from, shun from one’s home, family, planet, no longer part of, dead in their eyes. What if they do something which is viewed so wrong in the eyes of everyone they disown them and they are considered dead.

what do you think????

Jennifer

Subj: Re: Renewal
Date: 96-06-07 23:40:05 EDT
From: Kydreamer
Posted on: America Online

Congratulations Mr. Copeland, We’re all eyes and ears!

Subj: Re: Renewal
Date: 96-06-08 01:18:20 EDT
From: SHERzipp
Posted on: America Online

Congrats, Mr. Copeland & JMS. Your enthusiasm shines through in every episode!

Sher

Subj: The Smell of Cherry Pie
Date: 96-06-08 01:56:36 EDT
From: MeMeTwo
Posted on: America Online

Anybody remember Twin Peaks?

JMS loved it.

Anybody remember–

–Major Characters who “were not what they seemed”? Who changed in BIG ways after awhile?

–Strange, surrealistic dreams and visions that dropped obscure clues, and flashes back and forward?

–What happened to the Hero at the end of the second season?

How might the third season (had there been one) have started? He might have come back–like a Wolf…

Just some summer thoughts.

Subj: Re:Sheridan’s Fate
Date: 96-06-08 02:16:00 EDT
From: JVibber
Posted on: America Online

<< The biggest influence on JMS is … Twin Peaks >>

Oh NO!!!!

Does this mean that Bob will come back as the new Kosh?
Does a sudden influx of “strong women” include Audrey Van Horn? (Hubba, hubba).
Was that Laura Palmer’s double at Sheridan’s door, surprising Delenn into dropping the snowglobe?
Subj: Re: Ratings and other musing
Date: 96-06-08 04:17:53 EDT
From: ReddGator
Posted on: America Online

>>>>
ReddGator:
Of course I can post stuff in the ratings folder, but I also enjoy driving folks to abstraction in other folders as well. <<<<

John,

No offense intended. B5 is an outstanding dramatic series based on any measuring criteria. It’s great fun to speculate about the direction this series will take. However, the uncertainty of renewal was driving me (and probably many others) crazy. I am elated that it has finally been renewed, and I look forward to reading these posts and occassionally adding my $.02 worth. Congratulations on your 4th season.

Subj: Re: Summer episodes
Date: 96-06-08 04:22:23 EDT
From: ReddGator
Posted on: America Online
>>>>
Highway927:
You ask: Walkabout; Grey 17 is Missing; And the Rock Cried Out, No Hiding Place; Shadow Dancing —
Any ideas what these episodes are about?
Yes.
John Copeland
Producer – Babylon 5
>>>>

Nasty, John.

Subj: Re: Renewal
Date: 96-06-08 12:58:33 EDT
From: Filops
Posted on: America Online

Yayyy! Ya-hoo!

Subj: Renewal and WWEII
Date: 96-06-08 16:33:58 EDT
From: Theodosial
Posted on: America Online

I just first want to say congradulations on the renewal of B5 to JMS and everybody involved in the show.
I’m so happyyyyyyyyyyy!!!

Spoiler for WWEII below (just in case)

 

 

 

 

 

Did anybody else notice that in Londo’s vision of his death in “Coming of Shadows”, you could see that G’Kar’s eye was missing but he was NOT wearing a bandage, whereas in WWEII, he was very definitely wearing a black bandage/eyepatch?

I can think of three reasons:

1) A slipup – (NAAAHHH)
2) They didn’t have time to do the extra makeup needed for the missing eye (double NAAAAHH)
3) The future has changed between when Londo had his vision and the time of WWEII.

In that case, the future may change again, so don’t worry (or worry more!) about Delenn and John.
I think however, that Londo will die at the hands of G’Kar in all of B5’s possible futures.

 

Subj: Re:”Already dead” speculatio
Date: 96-06-08 17:37:55 EDT
From: WifeAgain
Posted on: America Online

BKnight255 said:
<<And if he found out she was alive … and had to either let her die … or kill her himself … it would be far, far worse than dying himself. Those of you who know what that feeling is, know that you’d rather tear your own guts out than let harm come to the one you love.

It’s my suspicion that he’s going to be forced to make that terrible choice … and that a part of him will die as a result…>>

Good point…it makes a lot of sense to me. Anyone who has loved deeply would rather die themselves than see the loved one hurt. John has gotten over his loss…but the old wound could be re-opened if Anna shows up.

Subj: Re:”Already dead” speculation
Date: 96-06-08 17:43:00 EDT
From: WifeAgain
Posted on: America Online

<<Aw, you all are just burning up the grey cells about this. And most of you are barking up the wrong tree. hehehehehehehe
John Copeland
Producer – Babylon 5>>

Oops, that’s why I get for posting before I read **everything**. I love this show! It drives me crazy!!! (And I’m having trouble at work getting my B5 macromachines to stay on the CPU. They keep flying off!) : )

Subj: Re:Renewal and WWEII
Date: 96-06-09 02:40:12 EDT
From: Archer C1
Posted on: America Online

<Did anybody else notice that in Londo’s vision of his death in “Coming of Shadows”, you could see that G’Kar’s eye was missing but he was NOT wearing a bandage, whereas in WWEII, he was very definitely wearing a black bandage/eyepatch?>

That’s funny. I do remember an eyepatch in “CoS”

Subj: Re: Renewal
Date: 96-06-09 17:35:50 EDT
From: MomVee
Posted on: America Online

Whoopee!
and double Whoopee!

This is definitely good news!

Subj: Re: Renewal
Date: 96-06-09 19:55:15 EDT
From: BARRIEJ
Posted on: America Online

>>Well gang today we got the official confirmation of our pick up for the fourth season of “Babylon 5.” So everyone can relax.
Whoopee!<<

RELAX! You’re teasing us again, Mr. Copeland. You know we don’t have any fingernails left, the popcorn is gone, are teeth are gnawed down to the bones, our eyes are blood shot from staring at our computer screens trying to figure this all out,

and you say “relax” I need a memory transplant, then I’ll relax. but then I’d have to start all over from the beginning.
sigh.
Subj: Speculation-Londo Prophec
Date: 96-06-09 20:29:47 EDT
From: BARRIEJ
Posted on: America Online

>>There is one device left. One must die to be reborn. Think about it….<<

I didn’t see no Minbari in that prison cell, John didn’t use it.
Subj: Re:”Already dead” speculatio
Date: 96-06-09 20:30:09 EDT
From: BARRIEJ
Posted on: America Online

So, death has many connotations, says Pigdog.
and keep track that we’re talking two different “death’s” here. One is for:

the prophecy for Londo and
Kosh’s warning to Sheridan
physical (check out the old body), mental (like in brain transplant) attitude (like in beliefs), emotional (like in I loved you yesterday, today I hate you), spiritual (Yesterday you were god, today I am)

As for the list of those who have “died” not one of them is really confirmed that I’m aware of.

Talia (? “dissected” according to Bester)
Kosh ( ? I still say never trust a Vorlon, dead or living)
Londo’s dueling buddy (for sure, by Londo’s hand)
Anna Sheridan (?)
Morden (?)
The Late Centauri Emperor (he’s for sure dead)
Ironheart
Bester’s girlfriend Carolyn (?)
Lord Refa (halfway there)
Marcus (said his heart was dead to Delenn when he first met her in Matters of Honor – how come you didn’t pick up on this?)
—-
Everybody else on the show could be slated for some non-physical death.

There’s a famous saying “I die daily” so we all do, wearing out those grey cells Pigdog says were wasting on this.
Subj: Re: Sabotage
Date: 96-06-09 20:53:33 EDT
From: CRC2001
Posted on: America Online

Another hint, just tell me Mr. Copeland, will there be a massive fire fight between EF and B5 again? OOh

 

 

 

I’m just thinking, don’t answer if it will spoil it, but does Sheridan halt the fight with the Shadows leaving Centauri Prime to fend for itself because he goes back to save Earth.

Subj: Re:The Smell of Cherry Pie
Date: 96-06-09 20:55:57 EDT
From: CRC2001
Posted on: America Online

Could you brief me on exactly what Twin Peaks was about, I have no clue. I still think there was atleast A vampire episode. But I never watched it, it was past my bed time.

Subj: Re:The Smell of Cherry Pie
Date: 96-06-09 21:59:06 EDT
From: DaveShufon
Posted on: America Online

<<Could you brief me on exactly what Twin Peaks was about, I have no clue. I still think there was atleast A vampire episode. But I never watched it, it was past my bed time.>>

I don’t think this is something that can be explained in a post. Your best bet is to rent a couple of the videos (they’re all on tape) and see for yourself.

It does make me wonder though, if Sheridan’s going to start having some more strange dreams… He’s in his room – but it’s not his room – there are red curtains all around, a funky jazz beat playing, and a strange-looking midget (dancing in a very jerky fashion) who points to Melissa Gilbert, sitting on a couch, and says “DOESn’t she look… JUSTLIKE anna-SHER-idan?” And maybe a giant will try to warn him about going to Za’Ha’Dum – “Noooooooo-o-o-o!!!”

Hhmmmmm… Now I’m wondering if those guys have some connection to the Vorlons. They’re certainly cryptic enough. I guess that would mean the Black Lodge is on Za’Ha’Dum. And Mordan is just the most recent “host” for Bob.

Nah. I think I just need sleep!

Subj: “Babylon Peaks”
Date: 96-06-10 00:48:05 EDT
From: GTEfurd
Posted on: America Online

Wow…we may have a whole ‘nother category here…

A picture:

Sheridan, Garibaldi, Delenn and company dressed stylishly in Northwestern flannel;
drinking coffee, eatin’ donuts…chowing down on cherry pie…then they look up as
Kosh slowly enters, cradling a log….

The mind boggles!

 

Subj: Re:”Babylon Peaks”
Date: 96-06-10 01:54:34 EDT
From: JVibber
Posted on: America Online

The Vorlons are not what they seem.
Subj: Re: Re:”Already dead” specul
Date: 96-06-10 08:25:08 EDT
From: Badinov
Posted on: America Online

>>There’s a famous saying “I die daily” so we all do, wearing out those grey cells Pigdog says were wasting on this.<<

Of course there’s the famous Elizabethan/Shakespearean “to die”… euphemism for orgasm!
Now that’s an interesting twist

:->

Badinov

Subj: Re: the one who is dead
Date: 96-06-10 17:30:18 EDT
From: Timbo13
Posted on: America Online

First time on the Net, and the first thing I head for is B5.

I’ve spent an hour reading all the postings, and something intrigues me about Londo’s prophecies. You see, some time ago I saw Gerry Doyle & Wife on a UK show, the Big Breakfast, where they implied Talia Winters would be coming back. The spoilers I’ve read so far don’t mention her, so it must still be to come.
Since the last time we saw her, her personality had been wiped, is she now another candidate for the one who is dead?
PS is it just in UK that videos of Series 1have been released? It makes things a lot easier.
PPS good to know Channel 4 (UK) will notbe stopping after WWE2, but going right to the Season 3 finale. I knew there was a reason for living in England, other than the fish & chips!

Finally, a word to jms: congrats on series 4: we’re with you every step of the way

Subj: Re: Summer episodes
Date: 96-06-10 17:35:39 EDT
From: BPowell170
Posted on: America Online

Good answer, pigdog :) — very JMS of you!

— barb

Subj: Re: the one who is dead
Date: 96-06-10 17:39:34 EDT
From: BPowell170
Posted on: America Online

WOW — Talia coming back? That would be stupendous!

— barb

Subj: Re: Sabotage
Date: 96-06-10 20:22:06 EDT
From: PigDog13
Posted on: America Online

Oh, okay, if you’re dying for a hint. “No, boom today, boom tomorrow.” – S.Ivanova. See if that gives you a headache. :-)
John Copeland

Subj: Re:”Babylon Peaks”
Date: 96-06-10 20:23:01 EDT
From: PigDog13
Posted on: America Online

JVibber you write:

The Vorlons are not what they seem.

Neither is anybody else on B5.
John Copeland

Subj: Re:”Babylon Peaks”
Date: 96-06-10 20:56:10 EDT
From: MythoPhile
Posted on: America Online

<<The Vorlons are not what they seem.>>
What exactly do they SEEM? To me they seem like a bunch of overly hyped manipulative cowards who talk new-age meaningless babble except for when they impersonate personal authority figures to gain a psychological advantage.
I’d trust the Tiki-people before I’d trust them. And we know what the Tiki-people think of them.

Subj: Kosh
Date: 96-06-11 00:07:17 EDT
From: SarahACnnr
Posted on: America Online
Who is it exactly who is dead if “We are all Kosh.” ?

Subj: season’s end
Date: 96-06-11 01:00:38 EDT
From: HAL MMI
Posted on: America Online

Am I to assumke that “Interludes&Examinations”(the one wherein Kosh dies right??) is to be the last episode opf the season. As of this thursday I will have seen reruns three weeks in a row now.

Subj: Daywatch: Rumor Control
Date: 96-06-11 10:18:52 EDT
From: Filops
Posted on: America Online

Hey Mr. Copeland, if you’re still floating around in the ether here…. (c;

There’s this odd rumor that jms had to agree to wrap up his story during this fourth year. Anything to it?

Dan

PS — or should this be in a new “Ask Pigdog” folder? (c8

Subj: Re:Sheridan’s Fate
Date: 96-06-11 11:29:44 EDT
From: SYarmo8050
Posted on: America Online

Wonderful! So, do we meet the Log Lady next season?;)

Subj: Re:The Smell of Cherry Pie
Date: 96-06-11 13:49:54 EDT
From: CRC2001
Posted on: America Online

Your Hallucintating badly sir. But I kind of wonder about that Vorlon thing aswell.

Subj: Re:”Babylon Peaks”
Date: 96-06-11 13:50:37 EDT
From: CRC2001
Posted on: America Online

MORE HALLUCINATIONS?

Subj: Re: Sabotage
Date: 96-06-11 13:52:34 EDT
From: CRC2001
Posted on: America Online

You gave me a massive one, and now I have to go to the store and get some advil. By the way I just saw ceremonies of light and Dark again, and I never noticed that Ivavnova was, well, is she?

Subj: Re:season’s end
Date: 96-06-11 15:20:43 EDT
From: HAL MMI
Posted on: America Online

I’m respponding to my own message because i realized I was mistaken, WWE 1&2 are after I&E, but is that the end of the season?

Subj: Who Is What They Seem?
Date: 96-06-11 19:17:32 EDT
From: BKnight255
Posted on: America Online

“Nobody here is what they seem. Not Mollari, not Delenn, not Sinclair … and not me.”

G’Kar, “The War Prayer” (?)

Subj: Re:Daywatch: Rumor Control
Date: 96-06-11 20:05:07 EDT
From: PigDog13
Posted on: America Online

You’ll have to stay tuned for news about the coming season. It should be in the not too distant future.
John Copeland

Subj: Re: Ivanova
Date: 96-06-11 20:06:18 EDT
From: PigDog13
Posted on: America Online

What do you think, CRC2001?
John Copeland

Subj: Re:The Smell of Cherry Pie
Date: 96-06-11 20:13:58 EDT
From: DSNOLTE
Posted on: America Online

Twin Peaks is currently running on Bravo at 10:00am cst. every weekday. It’s currently 3-5 episodes in. They run 49 minutes uninterrupted.

Subj: Re: wwe2
Date: 96-06-11 22:34:00 EDT
From: SHERzipp
Posted on: America Online

Mr. C:

I know it was two weeks ago, but I just had a disturbing thought (okay, one disturbing thought among many…some brought on by your hilarious postings, I might add).

Up until now, three years of the story has corresponded to the three seasons. If WWE2 is showing things 17 years in the future and if the 5-year arc of the story is going to show this whole story, does that mean we’re going to be taking huge jumps in time over the next 2 seasons?

Oh, and by the way, are we talking about 1000 years back in Earth time or Minbari time?

Thanks,
Sher
Subj: Re:Daywatch: Rumor Control
Date: 96-06-12 01:01:34 EDT
From: Badinov
Posted on: America Online

>>There’s this odd rumor that jms had to agree to wrap up his story during this fourth year. Anything to it?<<

JMS replied to a posted question by saying something to the effect that IF someone put a gun to his head and said “year 4 is it!” then he could wrap things up by cutting out extraneous (non-arc) eps and doing some serious script crunching. He then continued to insist that B5 will go the full 5 yrs. (assuming WB renews it)

 
Badinov

(the above is subject to change without notice….yes)

Subj: Re: Sabotage
Date: 96-06-12 01:04:08 EDT
From: JVibber
Posted on: America Online

<< Oh, okay, if you’re dying for a hint. “No, boom today, boom tomorrow.” – S.Ivanova. See if that gives you a headache. :-)
John Copeland >>

Bugs Bunny: Hi, little guy. Whatcha doin’?
Marvin the Martian: Oh, I’m going to blow up the Earth.
Bugs Bunny: That’s nice.
Subj: Re:season’s end
Date: 96-06-12 01:04:51 EDT
From: Badinov
Posted on: America Online

>>WWE 1&2 are after I&E, but is that the end of the season?<<

according to the Lurker’s guide, there are 5 more (season 3) eps which will be aired in September, with season 4 to start immediately following.

We will all be stark raving mad by August.

Badinov

Subj: Re:season’s end
Date: 96-06-12 01:09:29 EDT
From: JVibber
Posted on: America Online

<< Am I to assumke that “Interludes&Examinations”(the one wherein Kosh dies right??) is to be the last episode opf the season. As of this thursday I will have seen reruns three weeks in a row now. >>

Oh, no, no NO! There is more. Much more! The two-parter “War Without End” (the flip side of the first season episode “Babylon Squared”) follows “Interludes and Examinations,” and WWE Part 2 is the last episode seen in the USA until fall. However, it gets complicated, because there are actually 5 more episodes after WWE 2 that are officially part of season three: “Walkabout”, “Grey 17 Is Missing,” “And the Rock Cried Out, No Hiding Place,” “Shadow Dancing,” and the final episode of the season, whose title is being kept secret.

So keep tuning in! You’re in for a bumpy ride!
Subj: Re:Sheridan’s Fate
Date: 96-06-12 12:25:05 EDT
From: RabLib
Posted on: America Online

S
P
O
I
L
E
R
S
P
A
C
E
<<You can see it coming, guys. The biggest influence on JMS is not King Arthur, not Lord of the Rings, not Gilgamesh or Childhood’s End. The key to where this season–and Sheridan–are going is–>>
<<Twin Peaks>>
NNNNNNNNNNNNNOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Subj: Re:”Babylon Peaks”
Date: 96-06-12 12:45:15 EDT
From: RabLib
Posted on: America Online

One more Twin Peaks parallel, Sheridan’s wife’s name was/is Anna, now what was the name of agent (sp?) Cooper’s love intrest in the second season? Annie.
—Tirtzah(little additions to chaos)

Subj: Re:Time Travel
Date: 96-06-12 19:06:14 EDT
From: VoxLumania
Posted on: America Online

<<. I can’t buy the fact that something that was seen as happening eight days in the future was changed, because since it didn’t happen, no message *could* have been sent. >>

That’s assuming that you see time as being a single plane. I think that the episode was trying to tell you that there can be multiple timelines. The message of B5 being destroyed came from the future that they were currently headed for. But by the end of the episode, a new timeline was created, and that future was avoided. Sort of like a train switching tracks.

Subj: Re:The Smell of Cherry Pie
Date: 96-06-12 21:43:29 EDT
From: DaveShufon
Posted on: America Online

<<Your Hallucintating badly sir.>>

*You* have never seen Twin Peaks!

Subj: Re:Time Travel
Date: 96-06-12 22:02:58 EDT
From: BKnight255
Posted on: America Online

Like JMS said, it’s the Schroedinger’s Cat problem. When the choices haven’t been made, both futures still exist (the one where B5 falls and the one where it (presumably) survives); it isn’t until they make the choice to actually *go* back and do their part that the fall of B5 is prevented.

At least that’s how JMS interprets it. Time travel is such a complicated morass, it makes me want to see a doctor … except with my luck this month, my insurance would refer me to Dr. Kervorkian, but that’s another story…

Subj: Re: Ivanova
Date: 96-06-13 13:00:35 EDT
From: CRC2001
Posted on: America Online

I don’t know JC but she said she loved Talia, and that would suck, because Garibaldi was after her too.

Subj: Re: Sabotage\spoiler
Date: 96-06-13 13:04:22 EDT
From: CRC2001
Posted on: America Online

If you don’t want a spoiler, don’t go much farther. But I am probably wrong so I wouldn’t worry about it.

 

 
JC hinted at Ivanovav in another message as he was discussing sabotage. Well she and Garibaldi both had a think for Talia, so there could be a neat little turn of events between the two. Hmm, sabotage?

Subj: Re:The Smell of Cherry Pie
Date: 96-06-13 13:05:22 EDT
From: CRC2001
Posted on: America Online

Ya, but I don’t see that happening in B5.

Subj: Re: Ivanova
Date: 96-06-13 14:37:58 EDT
From: Debipa
Posted on: America Online

hate to tell you guys, but there are more types of love then one

Subj: Re: Ivanova
Date: 96-06-16 11:44:44 EDT
From: CRC2001
Posted on: America Online

glad to here it.

Subj: Re: Sabotage
Date: 96-06-16 13:58:23 EDT
From: WifeAgain
Posted on: America Online

<<Oh, okay, if you’re dying for a hint. “No, boom today, boom tomorrow.” – S.Ivanova. See if that gives you a headache. :-)
John Copeland>>

Oh…..Mr. Copeland…..you are SO mean!

Subj: Re: Pigdog13
Date: 96-06-17 21:31:34 EDT
From: Dolby1000
Posted on: America Online

Don’t you have a fourth season to produce or something? These hints just drive me more crazy, which is so hard to take since we are still 3 months from these stories.
No, I just can’t stop myself from reading them.
No I won’t stop.
But, a congratulations on renewal. As you can see by these posts, B-5 has quite a following, and we all will be bald come Sepember from trying to figure this out. You should give away hair tonic with this stuff.

Subj: STV & Keepers
Date: 96-06-18 17:51:32 EDT
From: Badinov
Posted on: America Online

Are Londo’s *insects* really baby Keepers?
gak 😛
Badinov

Subj: Re: STV and Keepers
Date: 96-06-19 09:03:04 EDT
From: CAMButcher
Posted on: America Online

No Badinov, Jms said they were just bugs.

Cam

Subj: Re: STV and Keepers
Date: 96-06-19 18:11:57 EDT
From: CRC2001
Posted on: America Online

Maybe parasites, that would make sense wouldn’t it.

Subj: Congrats
Date: 96-06-19 20:16:14 EDT
From: HofstraGuy
Posted on: America Online

Just got word today that Babylon 5 has been “officially” renewed for a fourth season. Now that that is over with we can concentrate on the fourth season. Any word on when that will begin.

Subj: Late Delivery from Avalon
Date: 96-06-20 09:46:01 EDT
From: CAMButcher
Posted on: America Online

This weeks rerun…..

I did enjoy Michael York in this ep. Because it was *Michael York* I was willing to take that bungee jump into willing suspension of disbelief, and buy Marcus’ crazy theory that the guy was really Arthur.

Carol

Subj: What good is Camelot?
Date: 96-06-24 11:28:03 EDT
From: CarlZr
Posted on: America Online

Watching Michael York reenact the legend of Camelot this Sunday reminded me of an indignant article which ran in the Village Voice a couple of weeks ago.
A lot of New York City public school teachers are protesting because the Board of Education is requiring them to take a general knowledge and skills test. Western civilization is coming back into fashion, so the test asks a lot of questions which are dificult for teachers who were trained in a less demanding, more liberal time. The test will decide whether or not they are qualified to be teachers.
One of the teachers quoted in the article angrily demanded to know just what was the point of “…knowing about people like… Merlin.”
I hope he caught this episode.

Subj: Lady of the Lake?
Date: 96-06-24 11:44:42 EDT
From: Striker08
Posted on: America Online

I was wondering how they figured out that Delann was the Lady of the lake?

Subj: Re:Lady of the Lake?
Date: 96-06-25 05:23:40 EDT
From: MythoPhile
Posted on: America Online

<<I was wondering how they figured out that Delann was the Lady of the lake?>>
Serious answer: it made sense, in context. He was presumably relatively sane when he boarded the ship and he would have been trying to contact the Minbari ambassader to beg forgiveness on the aniversary of the event.
Frivolous answer: Of the .25 million people on this thing, only two are female, and it was either her or Ivanova.

Subj: Re:Lady of the Lake?
Date: 96-06-25 19:56:12 EDT
From: BPowell170
Posted on: America Online

She is Minbari, and the York character blamed himself for starting the war with the Minbari.

That’s my guess.

— barb

Subj: Re:The Smell of Cherry Pie
Date: 96-06-27 15:20:36 EDT
From: RabLib
Posted on: America Online

On B5 it’s Flarn instead of cherry pie.
Tirtzah:)

Subj: Re:The Smell of Cherry Pie`
Date: 96-06-27 18:56:42 EDT
From: DSNOLTE
Posted on: America Online

So will the Shadows smell like burnt motor oil?
Subj: Arthur was excellent
Date: 96-06-29 00:15:34 EDT
From: LoudonB
Posted on: America Online

I just saw the rerun of the King Arthur episode (sorry, can’t remember the name) and found out yet again just how brilliantly it was done. Other scifi series don’t take war and death as seriously as B5 does, and this episode showed just how inhumane an act it all is. Thank you for reminding me that we are still humans, and more power to you in the future.

LoudonB

Subj: Re:Confessions & L.
Date: 96-06-30 00:41:29 EDT
From: Jms at B5
Posted on: America Online

“That’s what I like about what JMS has done so far with this relationship, he brings out the wonder of falling in love, and this is the one thing that keeps bringing me back to the show.”

Falling in love IS magical.

jms

 
Subj: Re:Confessions & L.
Date: 96-06-30 18:42:11 EDT
From: Miles1005
Posted on: America Online

<<Falling in love IS magical.

jms>>

I knew she was messin with him!

Jim

 

Subj: save Babylon 5
Date: 96-07-01 18:43:43 EDT
From: MBrownA1
Posted on: America Online

Pten, a division of warner brothers may cancel Babylon 5 if we dont support it. send letters via snailmail to the pten executive comittee at

Warner Brothers
4000 Warner Blvd.
Burbank, California 91522
Attn: Babylon 5

Subj: Re:save Babylon 5
Date: 96-07-01 19:50:27 EDT
From: Archer C1
Posted on: America Online

The show is RENEWED for a fourth season! Get that through your heads!

Of course, it’s never to early to make sure they renew it for a fifth…<g>

Subj: Re:Confessions & L.
Date: 96-07-01 21:20:23 EDT
From: CRC2001
Posted on: America Online

<<Falling in love IS magical.

jms>>

Oh man, tell me about, or atleast dump a massive bucket of water on my face. Cause I think IT just happened, oh shoot, I’m only 16, the magic can’t happen yet!!!!!!!! AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Subj: Re:save Babylon 5
Date: 96-07-01 21:22:04 EDT
From: CRC2001
Posted on: America Online

Archer, please tell me why several people have come to the same conclusion if it is not at LEAST possible. I didn’t think so.

Subj: John’s father
Date: 96-07-04 14:43:09 EDT
From: BIL509
Posted on: America Online

I saw I&E again and then went to see ID4. I see the actor who plays John’s father, David, has a small part in the movie. Does any one know if he has played in any other shows or movies?

Bill

Subj: Ahhh its all so clear to me
Date: 96-07-05 21:40:09 EDT
From: Matthew770
Posted on: America Online

Okay–not to beat a dead horse. . . (or narn for that matter), BUT, the Minbari have B4, and Sinclair/Valen gave it to them–riiight? SOOOOO, you thnk they would know not to fly thier ships by an Earth Craft a thousand years later with their gun ports open–I mean–did Sinclair and Zathrus scrape all the English and whatever lettering and any vestiges of humanity out of B4???

And why not leave everyone a note like “When you see this ship–they’re paranoid–fly casual.” Or is because that Sinclair say in B squared that he tried to warn everyone and it just happens the same way–meaning that no matter what its always the same. HUNH???

 

Subj: Re:Ahhh its all so clear to
Date: 96-07-05 22:05:56 EDT
From: Zerf
Posted on: America Online

poetic liscence, me thinks.Looks like Delenn didn’t know much of the prophecy at fisrt contact with Earth ship. Looks like most of her knowledge came after, (B4 and Valen/Sinclair)

Subj: Re:Ahhh its all so clear to
Date: 96-07-06 00:09:03 EDT
From: CRC2001
Posted on: America Online

<<SOOOOO, you thnk they would know not to fly thier ships by an Earth Craft a thousand years later with their gun ports open–I mean–did Sinclair and Zathrus scrape all the English and whatever lettering and any vestiges of humanity out of B4???>>

It may be important for the human Minbari war to take place. Don’t ask why, I’m sure if you think about you’ll come up with your own little theory on that.

BAD

Subj: Re:Ahhh its all so clear to
Date: 96-07-07 00:16:57 EDT
From: Matthew770
Posted on: America Online

And another thing–the whosie-whatsis thinige that changes Sinclair to Valen and Delenn to a Human–who gave it to them. Of course herein lies the paradox:

Valen gives it to the, well whomever, for safekeeping, who give it to Delenn at an appointed time to gove to sinclair to give to whomever . . . .yadda yadda yadda. Of course there is that, what the hell its still neat theory that i abide by . . .

–Matt

Subj: New Episodes
Date: 96-07-07 14:17:16 EDT
From: MiniWabit2
Posted on: America Online

In the Ivanova folder, someone said that WWE 1&2 was not the season finallie and that two new shows were to be aired in July. Could someone tell me WHEN in July, since I don’t get TV Guide anymore. Thanks

Tiff

Subj: Re:New Episodes
Date: 96-07-07 15:00:02 EDT
From: LLarson10
Posted on: America Online

There will be NO new eps in July. Gotta wait til October.

Subj: Re:New Episodes
Date: 96-07-07 23:47:17 EDT
From: JVibber
Posted on: America Online

<< In the Ivanova folder, someone said that WWE 1&2 was not the season finallie and that two new shows were to be aired in July. Could someone tell me WHEN in July, since I don’t get TV Guide anymore. Thanks >>

No episodes in July. Or August. Or September. They are holding 5 episodes until October! This is NOT JMS’s fault, and he’s not happy about it. On the other hand, during this summer we have the Olympics, the national conventions for two political parties, and the assumption that everything else on during the summer is reruns anyway — so I can SORT of see the logic there. Nevertheless, it’s a long, long way from May to October.
Subj: Re:New Episodes
Date: 96-07-08 20:50:42 EDT
From: Ranger23
Posted on: America Online

Can you give me the exact date that the new season premiere will show & give me the name?

Subj: Re:New Episodes
Date: 96-07-09 00:21:31 EDT
From: Badinov
Posted on: America Online

>>Can you give me the exact date that the new season premiere will show & give me the name?<<

First you have to watch the last five shows of season 3. These will air in October. Season 4 will begin soon thereafter.

Check the episode section of the lurker’s guide for exact dates:

http://www.hyperion.com/lurk/
badinov

Subj: Re:save Babylon 5
Date: 96-07-09 17:47:43 EDT
From: Archer C1
Posted on: America Online

<<Archer, please tell me why several people have come to the same conclusion if it is not at LEAST possible. I didn’t think so.>>

Because on-line rumors breed like oversexed rabbits and if there was still a danger of the show not being renewed for season four, Pig Dog (John Copeland) and JMS would have been on line with dire warnings of doom. The last *reliable* word I got was that the show was renewed. Unless I hear otherwise from the Great Maker, it’s safe to assume things are hunky-dory.

Subj: Re:Ahhh its all so clear to
Date: 96-07-12 12:47:32 EDT
From: LatCrow
Posted on: America Online

The device is sent from Draal(sp?)via Zathras(sp?) to Jeffrey. The device travels into the past where Jeff uses it to become Minbari. The device then falls into the hands of the Grey Council where Delenn uses it 1000 years later. It’s just one device.
Regarding the B4 English bit. Jeff and Zathras would have to remove all the English wording prior to arriving–I think the Minbari would have remembered English writing and then realize that Earth was the source of the station 1000 years later during the war. Remember, too, that there were Vorlons aboard ship–The Vorlons and ‘Valen’ are what convinced the Minbari to use the station as a starbase of operations.

Subj: Re:save Babylon 5
Date: 96-07-13 23:00:16 EDT
From: SHERzipp
Posted on: America Online

I got word from J.Copeland that it was renewed and that the rumor I’d heard from a friend at UPN was wrong.

Sherry

Subj: What did Susan mean?
Date: 96-07-14 21:27:49 EDT
From: Gjscott10
Posted on: America Online

Due to misprogramming my VCR when the eposide originally aired, I just saw the re-run of the first hour of War Without End this week.. What did Susan mean when she said “I’ll be in the car” when Sheridan was trying to decide whether to take B4 into the past? Was it “I’ll be in the car when you make up your mind, just let me know what you decide,” or “I’ll be in the car ready to go cause I think we should”?????

Subj: Re:What did Susan mean?
Date: 96-07-15 01:11:06 EDT
From: Badinov
Posted on: America Online

I think it was more like “I’ll be in the getaway car, as we steal a space station” kind of like Bonnie & Clyde

:-)

Badinov

Subj: Archiving
Date: 96-07-15 19:12:50 EDT
From: B5 Online
Posted on: America Online

Im going to archive this board, please continue this discussion in the # 2 folder. Thanks.

 

 

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